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I finally understand the "My Culture is not Your Costume" thing after seeing this shit.
Euphoric Christian Fatigue Thread
- Iniciador del tema AspieNextDoor
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- 2 de Abr, 2023
That's not necessarily true. One of the more annoying things about the bible is that it can be confusing as to what rules are meant to be more important than others. For example, Christ says you should love him above your own family, but he also scolds the Pharisees for allowing their traditions to get in the way of 'honor thy father'. (Edit: I guess in this case Christ is the physical avatar of God who is like a universal father, which means he takes priority over your temporal dad?)
And I mean, if you have a horrible, dysfunctional, abusive family it stands to reason you should cast them aside. The bonds of family can only be so strong.
That really depends on your perspective. There are a lot of Christians, particularly protestants, who state that the new covenant created by Christ invalidated the old one. Stripping the Jews of their chosen status was a part of that, and by the modern standards they would be no more special than the next guy.
Evangelical churches, as I understand it, have some kind of loose monetary or organizational connection to Judaism, or I at least remember more than one person saying so, so that's why you have them simping for Israel.
There's another thing that befuddles me, Christianity is treated as this great universal truth but if you genuinely believe in eternal damnation then you might as well be playing Russian Roulette with all the denominations which exist. Sure they all agree on the basic premise that Jesus is their savior and he'll give them eternal life, but if a doctrinal misstep is enough to have the big JC chastising you, then can't you accidentally choose to be the wrong type of Christian and go to hell anyway?
Fuckin' bugged Salvation mechanics.
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- 24 de Ene, 2023
No, not really. Denominations aren't biblical, and heart of the matter plays the biggest role. As someone I know said, "it's so nice of God to set things up the way even retards will be saved." On itself the pattern persists throughout the Bible, God pretty much aims at working with our missteps and swapping sin into glory, not condemning each and everyone who fails. (That would have contradicted basis of Christianity.) So while there are things across denoms that are pointless, weird, unbiblical, as long as the main requirement is met, the rest is optional and probably only relevant to the person's journey. That's at least how I explain people I met from other denoms who may practice something that seems off to me, but I saw fruit of their spirit and I'm fully convinced it works within them, so "wrong" or "right" denomination isn't really that important.
This seems easy to me. Yes, you should put literal God above all. However, if you use God as an excuse to avoid helping out your family, you aren't being good here, you're just trying to find a convenient way out of responsibility. This isn't a jab at you, but I find it interesting that many people usually have issues with Christianity (or rather, Christians) for being way too "black and white" and demanding to be more critical and seeing context/gray areas in/complexity of our lives, when in reality Christianity fundamentally requires sober mind and encourages critical thinking through explicit questioning (I said this before and I'll say it again, the original apostles were absolute clowns, not "righteous" by our standards people) instead of a crude set of robotic rules.
Same goes to abusive families. Yes, the general blueprint is that you must honor your parents for bringing you into this life and raising you*, everyone deep down knows that there's something wrong about a child who has been raised by good people but abuses them, leaves them behind for no valid reason and so on, this forum is full of examples. God is aware that the world is broken though and people who drag you down must be avoided, no matter who they are, there are literally verses warning against angering your children. Perfect blueprint doesn't mean that it can't fall apart. I found proof of this in life itself. For a child to grow up healthy and mature properly, both natal parents must be present within a loving relationship. If that doesn't happen, children grow up broken to a varying degree (proving that the blueprint is correct), but it doesn't mean that they must have been aborted or killed or whatever to "avoid the pain of living in this world", it all can still be salvaged into something great, and you can "honor"/forgive your parents from far away, as time goes by you probably might start understanding that they're just some broken people as well.
*Which on itself exists for many other theological reasons that all come together, and not just in vacuum, but I don't really have much time/aren't that good at it yet to discuss it seriously. What comes to my mind as an example is that child abuse is the most radical, extreme, dare I say satanic, way of cutting the person from God. Why? Because it's a basic pattern: if a child can't trust their earthly parent, how can they trust the ultimate creator?
The Tall Man
kiwifarms.net
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- 4 de Ago, 2022
Try to look at it from my simple view. Jesus Christ is a Jewish man who follows the Torah and also the Sanhedrin.
Now a Jewish man does not hold Gentiles and Jews to the same standard.
He in fact expected way higher standards of his fellow Jew than of any Gentiles.
Looked at from that perspective it makes perfect sense that he expects his fellow Jews to uphold bloodlines, traditions and hold family in high regard.
It might be true that the relationship with your family can be incredibly bad and sometimes it is smarter to distance yourself, but you cannot remove your family from your identity. Ultimately no matter how dysfunctional they are a part of you. Nobody is an atomized individual.
Even they hold Jews in higher regard than themselves and their own history, family and lineage. They believe in Jewish history as found in the Torah and Tanakh, venerate Jewish patriarchs and hold Jewish places in higher regards than any of their own.
Jesus followed all the Jewish laws, he was an observant Jew. Who respected Judaism deeply.
I think this is because the real crack inside Christianity that turns people into Jesus junkies is the promise of salvation. For some who were exposed to the idea of eternal hellfire at a young age, fear can be a massive factor.
But for the true believer, nothing beats the promise of salvation. They are often weak, get taken advantage of their entire lives, so the idea of being richly rewarded after death for being a loser in this life is incredibly powerful.
At its surface, it sounds pretty silly. You would think only the most gullible people would fall for it: Pay tithes, follow what the priests say, help convert more people, obey the rules the church gives you, and once you die, you’ll be rewarded handsomely.
However, when you look at it from the perspective of a weak person with a strong sense of justice, it starts to make sense. They can’t fathom that reality isn’t like a Hollywood movie.
The evil guy who murders people, hates everyone, scams millions, gets the girl, the mansion, the sports car, stays healthy, and finally dies at 97 in his bed surrounded by family, and then has his legacy rewritten by his (((friends))) so he’s remembered as a philanthropist and pillar of the community. Where is the justice?
There has to be justice somewhere, right?
And this is where Paul comes in. He takes the concept of the noble lie and fuses it with Jewish ideas to create Christianity.
Paul was a student of Gamaliel, one of the most respected rabbis of the Sanhedrin. He wasn’t some random Jewish guy, this is the equivalent of someone who studied directly under the Pope.
What did Paul offer the downtrodden? Something even better than revolt: they win without having to lift a finger. You don’t have to do anything against those who abuse you, steal from you, persecute you, or kill you. All you have to do is join the group, observe its rituals, and you will be happy forever after you die, while those who trampled on you will suffer for eternity. Sounds too good to be true.
And that is why Christians (and Muslims, who have pretty much the same deal) can overlook almost any inconsistency or problem and cling to their belief as if their life depended on it.
If you’ve ever tried to talk someone out of an obvious scam, like a pyramid scheme, you’ll notice they usually don’t want to hear it. They want to believe in the big payout. Once they’ve fallen for it, admitting they got scammed becomes almost impossible. They might even laugh at other people falling for different pyramid schemes, but they’ll fiercely defend their own. Same thing with Christians.
But for the true believer, nothing beats the promise of salvation. They are often weak, get taken advantage of their entire lives, so the idea of being richly rewarded after death for being a loser in this life is incredibly powerful.
At its surface, it sounds pretty silly. You would think only the most gullible people would fall for it: Pay tithes, follow what the priests say, help convert more people, obey the rules the church gives you, and once you die, you’ll be rewarded handsomely.
However, when you look at it from the perspective of a weak person with a strong sense of justice, it starts to make sense. They can’t fathom that reality isn’t like a Hollywood movie.
The evil guy who murders people, hates everyone, scams millions, gets the girl, the mansion, the sports car, stays healthy, and finally dies at 97 in his bed surrounded by family, and then has his legacy rewritten by his (((friends))) so he’s remembered as a philanthropist and pillar of the community. Where is the justice?
There has to be justice somewhere, right?
And this is where Paul comes in. He takes the concept of the noble lie and fuses it with Jewish ideas to create Christianity.
Paul was a student of Gamaliel, one of the most respected rabbis of the Sanhedrin. He wasn’t some random Jewish guy, this is the equivalent of someone who studied directly under the Pope.
What did Paul offer the downtrodden? Something even better than revolt: they win without having to lift a finger. You don’t have to do anything against those who abuse you, steal from you, persecute you, or kill you. All you have to do is join the group, observe its rituals, and you will be happy forever after you die, while those who trampled on you will suffer for eternity. Sounds too good to be true.
And that is why Christians (and Muslims, who have pretty much the same deal) can overlook almost any inconsistency or problem and cling to their belief as if their life depended on it.
If you’ve ever tried to talk someone out of an obvious scam, like a pyramid scheme, you’ll notice they usually don’t want to hear it. They want to believe in the big payout. Once they’ve fallen for it, admitting they got scammed becomes almost impossible. They might even laugh at other people falling for different pyramid schemes, but they’ll fiercely defend their own. Same thing with Christians.
Funny, I never had these types of criticisms against most Christians I know.
My biggest criticism is that they have a Platonist view of reality and identity.
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- 2 de Abr, 2023
Well that's what I feel this thread is about ultimately, the kinds of """Christians""" who are so inflexible and unsound of mind. Those who lean upon their own understanding despite being told not to, who know nothing and think they know instead of knowing that they know nothing.
What's wrong with that?
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- 18 de Jun, 2025
Speaking from the perspective of what I believe in, that being Catholicism, this problem is solved by invincible ignorance. If by some chance one were to with good faith look into the correct faith, and still with good faith not be convinced of it, that would factor into their judgement. As well as this, if someone were to never hear of the correct faith at all, like those born on secluded islands, that would also factor into their judgement as well.
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- 2 de Abr, 2023
Just going off how Big J is presented in the bible, I get the distinct impression he would not think well of the Catholic Church.
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- 18 de Jun, 2025
Depends on your perspective. Why do you think this specifically?
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- 2 de Abr, 2023
It's a lot to get into, but to boil it down I'd say it's because it's the most human church. Jesus was very much a hardliner and thought pretty poorly of people who allowed their cultural traditions to interfere with scriptural doctrine, which the Catholic church has a habit of doing, the incorporation of pagan holidays being an example.
Note this isn't a knock against Catholicism; one of the things I like about Catholics over Puritans is that they recognize that humans are human and not meat robots and expecting people to forsake every single worldly thing for a shot at the hereafter is a pipe dream.
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- 7 de Sep, 2024
Loving and appreciating the family structure is nowhere near idolization.
This is the kind of worldview that drives people away from Christianity and causes millennials to make kneejerk "deathcult11!1!!!" reactions whenever confronted by it. God created the world and saw that it was good. After the fall of man only Jesus can truly reverse all that fall (NOT earthly laws). Paul wrote against the Mosaic Law for this reason. Now that I think about it a great many of popular Christianity's problems have been caused through halfassed interpretations of Paul...
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The Tall Man
kiwifarms.net
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- 4 de Ago, 2022
The Platonist view of identity is essentially the same as the Christian one, just without Jesus. Both rely heavily on synthetic reasoning, you start with fixed axioms and build your understanding outward from there. When it comes to identity, both conclude that you are essentially a ghost guy piloting a meat robot.
However, if you use analytic reasoning, stripping away parts until you can’t anymore, this view collapses. Losing your legs clearly changes your behavior and experience. This shows that your body and mind are not truly separable. You also cannot live without water, air, or food, proving they are inseparable from your identity as well.
The proper view of identity is that you are: spirit–mind–body–family–race–environment, and so on. You cannot become part of a different race, for example, it is inseparable from who you are. Of course, there is a hierarchy within identity. Your mind and body matter more to you than the fact that you are a mammal, which in turn matters more than which continent you live on.
If you build on lies, you will create perversions.
This is exactly what happens when you adopt the Platonic view of identity. If you see yourself as a little ghost guy piloting a meat robot, it becomes easy to justify anti-social behavior, because you are supposedly separate from society. You can justify transgenderism, transhumanism, and much more.
When identity includes the body, transgenderism and transhumanism become acts against yourself. Similarly, anti-social behavior becomes an act against yourself once you realize society is also inseparable from you.
Many of today’s problems could be avoided by adopting a more accurate view of identity.
Plato’s View of Reality
This world is a shadow of a higher metaphysical alternate reality. This is similar to the Christian view of the world as a wrong fallen place and the Kingdom of Heaven as the true, perfect one. This idea stems from Plato being weak at analytic reasoning and relying mostly on synthetic reasoning. Starting from small observations, such as what the Pythagoreans discovered through geometry, he tried to categorize all of Nature using his limited rules.
He ended up confusing objects with concepts.
Instead of admitting he might be wrong, his arrogance led him to conclude that the physical world is defective and that he was trapped in this wrong world, while the perfect world his philosophy described is the true one he is barred from.
Plato’s main mistake was that he couldn’t accept that one concept can't perfectly describe one object. He turned reality upside down and claimed that the concepts (the Forms) are the real, true things, while the physical objects are the imperfect, fake copies.
There are big books written about this, so I’ll leave it here. Schopenhauer, building on Kant, completely dissected idealism and showed it to be highly irrational.
However, if you use analytic reasoning, stripping away parts until you can’t anymore, this view collapses. Losing your legs clearly changes your behavior and experience. This shows that your body and mind are not truly separable. You also cannot live without water, air, or food, proving they are inseparable from your identity as well.
The proper view of identity is that you are: spirit–mind–body–family–race–environment, and so on. You cannot become part of a different race, for example, it is inseparable from who you are. Of course, there is a hierarchy within identity. Your mind and body matter more to you than the fact that you are a mammal, which in turn matters more than which continent you live on.
If you build on lies, you will create perversions.
This is exactly what happens when you adopt the Platonic view of identity. If you see yourself as a little ghost guy piloting a meat robot, it becomes easy to justify anti-social behavior, because you are supposedly separate from society. You can justify transgenderism, transhumanism, and much more.
When identity includes the body, transgenderism and transhumanism become acts against yourself. Similarly, anti-social behavior becomes an act against yourself once you realize society is also inseparable from you.
Many of today’s problems could be avoided by adopting a more accurate view of identity.
Plato’s View of Reality
This world is a shadow of a higher metaphysical alternate reality. This is similar to the Christian view of the world as a wrong fallen place and the Kingdom of Heaven as the true, perfect one. This idea stems from Plato being weak at analytic reasoning and relying mostly on synthetic reasoning. Starting from small observations, such as what the Pythagoreans discovered through geometry, he tried to categorize all of Nature using his limited rules.
He ended up confusing objects with concepts.
Instead of admitting he might be wrong, his arrogance led him to conclude that the physical world is defective and that he was trapped in this wrong world, while the perfect world his philosophy described is the true one he is barred from.
Plato’s main mistake was that he couldn’t accept that one concept can't perfectly describe one object. He turned reality upside down and claimed that the concepts (the Forms) are the real, true things, while the physical objects are the imperfect, fake copies.
There are big books written about this, so I’ll leave it here. Schopenhauer, building on Kant, completely dissected idealism and showed it to be highly irrational.
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- 18 de Jun, 2025
I 2nd this. To truly love God we must obey Him, and one of His commands is to provide for your family and especially to honor your parents. It doesn’t do away with these things, but upholds them. If I remember correctly too, it was Abraham who was asked to sacrifice his son, but this was merely a test of obedience and God would never think such things are actually just as Abraham was told to stop before he could do it.
Also, and while my biblical knowledge is not the best, if I’m correct Jesus chastised the Pharisees for not caring for their parents.
HowlingChasm
kiwifarms.net
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- 16 de Abr, 2025
Fedoras never did anything so cringe as make waifu OC and this shit is like 12 years old now. The tradcel LARP should have been ridiculed from the get-go.
The Tall Man
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- 4 de Ago, 2022
This pick your own version of Christianity is a bit silly, don't you think?
If Jesus didn't come and die for your sins then you could never get salvation since you are not a Jew but a gentile.
Jesus fulfilled prophecy that is why you have new rules and you don't have to follow all those little Jewish ones. It's the new covenant.
You can't then just take the pro family and or pro tribe rules found in the old testament and start adopting those as your own when you are Christian.
Not only because Jesus brought you new rules, but also because those old laws about honoring family and your tribe only apply to Jewish people.
The only place a pro family message is found in the NT is when Jesus addressee the Pharisees about breaking the law of the OT since they are Jews and have to follow those laws.
(Edit: there are a few more, but there are more about giving up on earthly things like family and blood. The overall message is still that the best thing to do is to submit your everything to Christ and not to any earthly things like family.)
Jews are supposed to honor family and their tribe and Christians are supposed to give up on earthly things and get their reward for doing so after they are dead.
And I think this picking and choosing is what you would judge a modern Priest for when they justify transgender marriages with
Galatians 3:28.
"There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."
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- 18 de Jun, 2025
Those laws still apply to Christian’s today. Some old laws like the restrictions on pork and shellfish are no longer in place, but not all of God’s commands went away.
Of course, Christian’s are to still love all people, but there’s a special honor reserved for one’s parents. That’s why let’s say if someone insulted their mother, that would be far more grave than insulting anyone else.
The Tall Man
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- 4 de Ago, 2022
Sure, some were given to the Gentiles by Jesus, but he is very clear that family, blood and soil are to be overcome for Gentiles.
Now the Church of course wanted more Christians and this anti-family message wasn't very popular with many people, so they did push a pro-family stance. I mean there wouldn't be much Christianity left if they all went the path of eunuchs.
You cannot tell me, that you honestly believe Jesus did not teach about giving up on earthly things, which include family.
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- 7 de Sep, 2024
Yes, exactly. It isn't necessarily a "follow these rules exactly or you shall PERISH" type of thing (which as I mentioned Paul wrote against) but instead is the key to a full Christian worldview. You can't fully understand God's nature and human nature without understanding the Old Testament. Throwing away that worldview (which Jesus pretty clearly based his teachings off of) leads to stuff like this:
In order to really understand Paul you have to understand the Old Testament. The person that reads the entire Bible (including Paul) will come out with a totally different understanding compared to the person that only reads Paul, because you really do need lots of context to understand what he was talking about much of the time.
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- 18 de Jun, 2025
Only if someone puts those things above God is it considered to be bad in Christianity. All good things can be bad depending on how they’re positioned. And celibacy is just one path for Christianity. (Being a Eunuch is self-mutilation so it’s important to distinguish between this and celibacy. Celibacy is resisting sexual urges. Cutting off your balls is not good.) Family is considered another very honorable thing.
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- 2 de Abr, 2023
That runs counter to "be fruitful and multiply" though. I mean, you could argue this is directed specifically at Jews, as I assume you would, but I think the general reading is that this applies to all mankind.
And as for people who did castrate themselves for Jesus... don't look up Skoptsy.
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- 7 de Sep, 2024
You really can't argue that point because it, in Genesis, comes before Abraham and the creation of Judaism. The same thing goes for the prohibition of blood, which is why it is prohibited for both Jews and Gentiles (which is affirmed multiple times throughout the Old and New Testaments).