The Comics and Manga Griefing thread - Comic and Manga really can suck.

[ToroidalBoat]

"woke"

I define "woke" as "identity politics" bullshit unique to Current Year. That way having a lesbian couple alone doesn't mean "woke"*, but having such in a Clown World way is.

* (if it's degenerate or not is another debate)

 

[Battlefield2142EU]

* (if it's degenerate or not is another debate)

You made valid points. The Boys TV show on Amazon is indeed woke trash with horrible writing. The Boys comic is indeed as degenerate as a comic can be, but it is very much what we call an anti-woke comic. The boys' comic was mocking both the Bush and Clinton administrations. The comic used racial slurs to mock white savior complexes before "woke" became a term.

 

[Kari Kamiya]

I will never respect or take women seriously as protagonists. There are plenty of women in my life that I love, respect and care about. But for the life of me I can’t look at “woman in armor and in combat” seriously and I’m always holding back a chuckle. Nerd media magnifies this chauvinism tenfold due to how inept it is.

This is why I only read shoujo manga for my female protagonist fix anymore even though the vast majority of them are high schoolers. For josei series, I've found Yuki Yoshihara scratches my itch for the many silly horny women she's written. And even then, I seem to have limited myself to no newer than 2010-ish at this point based on the titles I've been picking up.

Seriously, Yoshihara's work is a goldmine.

Modern works cannot be this self-restraining and honest without getting egotistical about "muh female sexual empowerment" shit.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

So it looks like Marvel is no longer paying their freelancers. Is this the begining of the end?

 

[Mystery Spy]

While I agree with the majority of why comics decayed, I doubt they will ever comeback and be as great as they were in the pre-internet era.

At least manga is cheap, but even they have huge piracy issues. My point isn’t “piracy bad ” but rather that it’s hard to justify and convince kids or even teens to got to stores and spend money, and time, in an age that has trained them to be reliant on phones and iPads for quick entertainment.

Even if comics magically got rid of all the woke shit and bad writting, they would still have issues with pricing and an outdated publishing method that makes Blockbuster look good.

 

[ToroidalBoat]

Ah, they don't make it their whole personality, therefore it's okay

I hold the more moderate view that not all sexuality is always degenerate.

Like there's a big difference between an animu woman in a skimpy American flag bikini eating a burger, versus "loli" and "shota" crap.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

Here is how I would try to save comics.

Instead of 30 pages a month on paper I would make them one page a day digitaly and make them ad supported and pay to have them show up in cellphone's news feed along side things like Youtube and twitter threads, so kids see them, then when you have 180 pages release them in a special collector's issue on paper that people who want them in that form can buy.

 

[Battlefield2142EU]

So it looks like Marvel is no longer paying their freelancers. Is this the begining of the end?

I had a feeling the inkers will be the first job that will get replaced by AI.

 

[MIU]

I hold the more moderate view that not all sexuality is always degenerate.

Well, I don't either necessarily. But I think all *homo*sexuality is

Like there's a big difference between an animu woman in a skimpy American flag bikini eating a burger, versus "loli" and "shota" crap.

I don't mind the occasional beach episode. But I do think there's definitely a limit. When it feels like I am watching softcore porn, I'll turn it off.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

I had a feeling the inkers will be the first job that will get replaced by AI.

It's sad but their job will be pretty easy for a computer to do.

 

[ToroidalBoat]

Here is how I would try to save comics.

The way I would try to save comics is to just go back to that way the comics were drawn in the 20th century.

Like looking at how Superman comics were before the plot got all convoluted and definitely before "woke" BS.

 

[Battlefield2142EU]

It's sad but their job will be pretty easy for a computer to do.

I’m stunned that inkers still a industry's job.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

The way I would try to save comics is to just go back to that way the comics were drawn in the 20th century.

Like looking at how Superman comics were before the plot got all convoluted and definitely before "woke" BS.

Yes but unless you find a new way to get thode better comics in front of kids it will not matter, the problem is content but it is also distrobution and format that has be changed as well.

 

[From The Uncanny Valley]

Here is how I would try to save comics.

Instead of 30 pages a month on paper I would make them one page a day digitaly and make them ad supported and pay to have them show up in cellphone's news feed along side things like Youtube and twitter threads, so kids see them, then when you have 180 pages release them in a special collector's issue on paper that people who want them in that form can buy.

They should do the Jump/Sunday/Champion etc. model that works for Japan

 

[Thiletonomics]

While I agree with the majority of why comics decayed, I doubt they will ever comeback and be as great as they were in the pre-internet era.

At least manga is cheap, but even they have huge piracy issues. My point isn’t “piracy bad ” but rather that it’s hard to justify and convince kids or even teens to got to stores and spend money, and time, in an age that has trained them to be reliant on phones and iPads for quick entertainment.

Even if comics magically got rid of all the woke shit and bad writting, they would still have issues with pricing and an outdated publishing method that makes Blockbuster look good.

Manhwa also has issues with piracy. The big difference is that the South Koreans go after manhwa pirates MUCH harder, to the point that Korean chaebols like Kakao (even though they're very small compared to the giants like LG and Samsung) have taken down numerous manga repositories. It was also worth noting that during the Kadokawa acquisition talks by Sony, Kakao, along with Chinese tech giant Tencent, were also interested in purchasing Kadokawa. It ended with Sony getting more of Kadokawa's shares, but a Kakao-owned Kadokawa would have sped up the takedowns of anime and manga repositories even faster.

 

[God of Nothing]

I don't think there is a genre of comic that I dislike more than essay/journal/biographic... Of WOMEN.

Oh you mean a woman who did or went through such a life altering experience and has a story to tell? No nononono, we can't have those, what we have is the I am a lesbian or whore who discovered myself or the I have this relationship that really made me so mad that I made this 300 pages comic about it.

And as more time passes, more women do it and the less interesting stuff happens in their lives.

It is just too tiresome

did you really expect something of substance from women?

it's surely a coincidence every show or game studio becomes shitty when they explicitly mention adding female writers to the team

I will never respect or take women seriously as protagonists. There are plenty of women in my life that I love, respect and care about. But for the life of me I can’t look at “woman in armor and in combat” seriously and I’m always holding back a chuckle. Nerd media magnifies this chauvinism tenfold due to how inept it is.

Like I’m not a foam at the mouth retard (that I know of) and I don’t hate women on principle, I just look at sword and shield “serious” Wonder Woman for example and not look at with the same eyes I look at crap like Deadpool. So the modern trends are just bad comedy to me.

Which in my opinion, this is the best way to handle people who like the “modern female protagonist” they want you to foam at the mouth at shit like Laufey or the lesbians in House of the Dragon, they don’t want you to laugh. Anger means you’re taking it seriously enough to work yourself up but laughing means you view it for what it is, a joke.

I don’t even do the “hurr durr biological differences, women soldiers are ineffective,” belief. They just look stupid and my boys who drink beer for breakfast and coach football could easily take your average “female soldier” and still have room for another rumble.

Because they're not women
They're men with tits stapled on to them.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

Don't throw all female writers under the bus just because the wrong ones get hired these days.
Agatha Christie perfected the mystery novel, D.C Fontana largely made Star Trek what it was, No one did more to shape The Rockford Files than Juanita Bartlett, and there are many more.

Comics. games, and films are being run into the ground by woke idiots of both genders, just look at Naughty Dog, or Bendis and Tom King at DC, or J.J Abrams in TV and movies.

Idiocy doesn't know a gender, if it did Star Wars would be getting fixed now.

 

[BubbaRobot887]

So it seems the current writers of Spider-Man are so bad Marvel doesn't trust them to write TASM #1000 and they are bringing in Frank Miller of all people to write it.

What is really strange is I can remember when the comic industry declared him a racist for daring to depict muslim terrorists as evil after 9/11 but now when they want to sell to the general public they are willing to work with him.

 

[Kari Kamiya]

So it seems the current writers of Spider-Man are so bad Marvel doesn't trust them to write TASM #1000 and they are bringing in Frank Miller of all people to write it.

Can the man even write optimism at all? Spider-Man isn't just doom and gloom and "woe is me, my power hurts my loved ones" shit, he's literally just some average guy trying to juggle two lives/jobs and his morals even when up against villains whom have known him personally and want revenge. Even when things turn gruesome he still carries on.

Quesada really should've been tard-wrangled while writing "One More Day", or thrown out sooner.

 

[Nick Obre]

This is a basic bitch point that's been made I imagine a million times over, but it should be illegal, or highly frowned upon, to have drastically different artists do the covers vs the interior art.

In manga, the covers are better than the interior art, but they'll be by the same artist, just with more effort.

In comics, this is also a good practice followed by publishers a lot of the time, but then both in mainstream and indie comics, you get shit like this

Spoiler: Lots of images so I'm putting this under the cut

Cover

Interior



Cover

Interior


Particularly bad are those publishers like Dynamite or Zenescope, who use pin up artists to bait the gooners with covers like these

And then the interiors are like this

(DC and Marvel have historically been pretty bad about it too, but in looking for recent examples, I found that they seem to be putting a little more effort into using decent artists, even when there's quality discrepancies with the covers. The worst cases I could find were in tertiary books whose existence itself I struggle to justify, like Psylocke Ninja or Rogue, and even then the art isn't as egregious as the ones above)

This shit should count as false advertising. The stories may be great for all I know, but if I open the book and I see such a disparity, I'm immediately discouraged from continuing.
By contrast, from some time ago until now I've been into a lot of books by Daniel Warren Johnson, who seems to be a workaholic obsessed with doing everything himself including the covers; or books written by Rick Remender, who seems to make a point (or the publisher does, I don't know) of having the book's artist do the cover; and it's so nice to pick up, say, Do A Powerbomb or The Sacrificers, open them up and see the art inside matches the cover.

Now, I've seen some cases where the interior art is different but roughly equivalent to, or actually better than the cover, but it's fucking rare.
And also, I must declare myself a hypocrite, because I make an exception for things with a very clear stylistic intention in having a specific look for the covers and a different one for the interiors, like a lot of old Vertigo books had (like Sandman always having Dave McKean covers, who has a very unique artstyle, or Hellblazer having at different points people like McKean, Fabry, or Bradstreet as dedicated cover artists for extended periods of time; both titles with interior art by different artists of varying qualities).

Still, it fucking sucks to be deceived in the one medium where you should be judging the book by its cover.