Stop Killing Games (EU edition) - Moldman vs. Publishers

[Gobermental Supervisor]

You and whose army? @Gobermental Supervisor is right in that I don't fully understand the scope of the EU's remit, but I'm pretty sure they don't have the power to force these companies to do anything unless it actually violates EU law; all they can do is request they sit down and have a chat.

The only significant thing I remember the EU ever accomplishing in relation to video games was when they fined Nintendo for price-fixing, and that was 24 years ago.

The issue here is that this is a citizen request to a legislative body, governed by the EU commission.
People do not understand how this body works and have wild expectations for the timeline and immediate effect of "winning the topic".

The win here is that the EU Commission, the most powerful body in EU, has taken up the issue and WILL be investigating further how to address the topic.
Obviously they have to also talk to the industry to do that, you cannot govern by ignoring one side.

They will ALSO listen to representatives of the consumers, which is exactly our initiative SKG among others who represent consumer rights in the member states.

For example Germany has the "Verbraucherschutz Agentur" (Literally: Consumerprotection Agency), frequently goes to court in the name of consumers to bash companies over the head for illegal or misleading practices. Every EU country has such a body, as it is mandatory by EU law, and they will be asked for feedback or to figure out how the impact is in their country etc.

This was never going to be a case of "THIS IS ILLEGAL! YOU HAVE TO PAY 475 Quatrillion $US in penalties", that stage would come a long time after the initial win when companies violate the new rules created to address the issue.

For example it may be possible that companies can be required to release the tools to allow players to re-create the online service locally (or on the internet, as they like) and keep a game that requires online service alive.

Or they could be required to release a Doomsday Patch that disables the "Online Only" functionality, unlocks all additional content by default, and allow Singleplayer to be played forever.

But first we have to get to a point where a law is written, requirements are created, it passes through the parliament and becomes an actual enforceable law.

Anyone dooming right now simply never understood what SKG was asking the EU for, because we got EXACTLY what we wanted.

For the fags from the US, this is like asking the President to pick up the issue and he nods benevolently and tasks his people to create a commission that will write law that handles the issue. It takes time.


EDIT: The one thing that I think many people underestimate is that they actually wrote that under ALREADY EXISTING LAW consumers may be entitled to refunds.
So EU citizen could already write a complaint to their consumer protection agency and request support with the issue of refunding a game that was remotely disabled after the purchase. Or going through the EU arbitration process that companies HAVE TO submit to, and request the refund.

 

[Oliver Onions]

For the fags from the US, this is like asking the President to pick up the issue and he nods benevolently and tasks his people to create a commission that will write law that handles the issue

So what you're saying is we just need to get Trump to tweet '#StopKillingGames'.

 

[Gobermental Supervisor]

So what you're saying is we just need to get Trump to tweet '#StopKillingGames'.

To be honest, if Vance were to champion the topic he would secure himself a solid PR win that is hard to overstate.
If he manages to get a law passed in the US he would secure himself millions of voters for his presidential bid.

Hell, I'd visit the US and pay 5 homeless guys to vote for him.

 

[acid_ra1n]

I know that SKG dudes in their response bring this up already, but just for anyone here who is still confused, the reason the EU gave doesn't add up...like at all.

That's what people kept saying was this has nothing to do with IP law IP is a strawman
Well now the EU itself says its IP related so maybe they're just too incompetent to understand their own laws?

 

[Hannibalistique]

That's what people kept saying was this has nothing to do with IP law IP is a strawman
Well now the EU itself says its IP related so maybe they're just too incompetent to understand their own laws?

No, their job is to write laws that won't get passed by normal democratic processes in the member countries (because the people don't want them).
That they have to write public answers to the constituents explaining why they ignore them is just an awkward side hustle.

 

[Problematic User Forever]

#stop"buying"games

 

[SIMON THE PIEMAN]

That's what people kept saying was this has nothing to do with IP law IP is a strawman

If it's the IP law that's the issue here then how come there are thousands of games that are abandoned by the developers and yet are still playable thanks to dedicated server binaries that the devs themselves provided with the game?

 

[the aging locust.]

To quote Victoria Nuland "Fuck the EU!"

 

[acid_ra1n]

If it's the IP law that's the issue here then how come there are thousands of games that are abandoned by the developers and yet are still playable thanks to dedicated server binaries that the devs themselves provided with the game?

I'd have no idea you should ask the government officials that just denied the proposal. The site linked their phone numbers if you wanna give them a call

 

[Xavier Renegade Angel]

Kikes protecting kikes nothing to new to anyone that pays attention. It's the ones who have hope something good will happen from any governing body that kill me

 

[Sledgehammer Lobotomy]

i just dont play aaa presteigeslop games. i spent this morning playing star fox 64 and the last game i bought at full price was elden ring

 

[Whiskey]

i just dont play aaa presteigeslop games. i spent this morning playing star fox 64 and the last game i bought at full price was elden ring

You playing the pc port? Its pretty good

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

The win here is that the EU Commission, the most powerful body in EU, has taken up the issue and WILL be investigating further how to address the topic.
Obviously they have to also talk to the industry to do that, you cannot govern by ignoring one side.

That's literally the meme of "we decided to make a decision on when we will discuss the time to discuss making a decision". Yeah it's possible that the EU will follow up, but especially in the current political climate it's really unlikely they'll bother rather than throw it to the pile of of topics in perpetual limbo.

That's what people kept saying was this has nothing to do with IP law IP is a strawman
Well now the EU itself says its IP related so maybe they're just too incompetent to understand their own laws?

It only has to deal with ancient boomers thinking video games aren't worth the time, except making some new commissions to grift of.

 

[Many are saying this.]

People might be dooming too hard and too early on this one. The Commission (which has always been useless boomers and were never going to do anything) bounced it back to Parliament because they believe there's existing legal basis to deal with SKG. Parliament has been sympathetic to SKG so it's not hopeless.

 

[Gobermental Supervisor]

That's literally the meme of "we decided to make a decision on when we will discuss the time to discuss making a decision". Yeah it's possible that the EU will follow up, but especially in the current political climate it's really unlikely they'll bother rather than throw it to the pile of of topics in perpetual limbo.

No, that is literally how the legislative process works.
You bring something up for discussion and after the hearing of multiple parties on the topic the commission decided to pick up the topic and follow up on it.

Your comparison demonstrates a fundamental lack of understanding how government work.
The entire point of the option to bring a petition to the EU commission is so citizen can rally support to bring attention to an issue that politicians have not realized exists and.

We got their attention, now the next step in the process is to evaluate how solutions could look like.
You are just dooming before the process has even started. Very shortsighted and defeatist.

The overwhelming response of "bUt wE AlReAdY pReSenTeD thE sOlUtioN!!!!111" just shows how irradiated people's brains are from social media and instant gratification.

 

[Harvey Danger]

EDIT: The one thing that I think many people underestimate is that they actually wrote that under ALREADY EXISTING LAW consumers may be entitled to refunds.
So EU citizen could already write a complaint to their consumer protection agency and request support with the issue of refunding a game that was remotely disabled after the purchase. Or going through the EU arbitration process that companies HAVE TO submit to, and request the refund.

That would be nice, if there was already an established ability to force refunds for the things SKG brings up. But that Commission statement seemed to say the companies are in the clear as long as they said up front that they could cut things off:

must inform consumers about the duration and the conditions for terminating the contract before the consumers signs up for the video game.

If that means they have to commit to 3 years of active servers or whatever, then you have a remedy, but I don't think any companies have been doing that. The licenses usually say servers can be cut off at any time. The EU statement implies that's an acceptable term.

Maybe during the consultations the consumer side can demand set periods, forcing a company to commit to a real, enforceable term. Absent that, I don't think the existing remedies are actually enforceable against modern shitty EULA's.

 

[Gobermental Supervisor]

tl;dr: Too early to doom. Entirely possible it goes to shits, but this is only the 14th in 14 years of their existence, so this is an achievement in itself and I doubt it will just die as the Doomers predict.

That would be nice, if there was already an established ability to force refunds for the things SKG brings up. But that Commission statement seemed to say the companies are in the clear as long as they said up front that they could cut things off:



If that means they have to commit to 3 years of active servers or whatever, then you have a remedy, but I don't think any companies have been doing that. The licenses usually say servers can be cut off at any time. The EU statement implies that's an acceptable term.

Maybe during the consultations the consumer side can demand set periods, forcing a company to commit to a real, enforceable term. Absent that, I don't think the existing remedies are actually enforceable against modern shitty EULA's.

Potentially, yes.

But that is why:

Second, the Commission will work with consumer organisations and authorities to raise awareness about the applicable rights that protect consumers, including on safeguards protecting the economic interests of consumers. The Commission will report on the application of the Directive on digital content and digital services before the end of the year. Active enforcement of these existing consumer rights can also incentivise the providers to offer video games with longer lifespans and explore solutions for meeting consumer expectations.

This means the Commission will evaluate how well existing regulations address the issue. In this process organizations will also have the opportunity to give input and raise issues. This can either end with a determination that existing law is sufficient to protect consumer rights (Which we are saying it is no, that is the point of SKG) or with the result that they "No, the issue is not addressed by existing laws and requires an independent EU Directive that handles end-of-service for digital content", after which a process of writing a new EU Directive could be initiated, which after it is passed by the EU Parliament has to be adopted by member states as law.

It takes time.

 

[GeorgeFloydFentanylStash]

https://www.gog.com/

My nigga.

 

[Sheogorath]

So what you're saying is that this ends with the EU torns asunder and replaced with the fifth reich?

they targetted gamers

 

[the aging locust.]

https://www.gog.com/