Has the media and corporations left Men behind? - Are Women in control of the consumer market?

[UQ 770]

Once again I don't think it's woke concessions, it's just a smokescreen for basically saying "We want women in our industry, either as consumers or designers, so we can market to women"

Look at these designers, all these are Men talking about their young daughters. If you read between the lines, all the feminist/woke talk is just, "we need women gamers, they spend the cash." Apparently all these people are talking about their young daughters, never their young sons.

I guess the hormone therapy will fix that.

Just fucking drop dead from alcohol poisoning already dude. You're making me want to beat you to it.

 

[V0dka]

Just fucking drop dead from alcohol poisoning already dude. You're making me want to beat you to it.

I'm trying, but it's expensive.

 

[Sīn the Moon Daddy]

I'm trying, but it's expensive.

You're doing God's work. Bless you child

 

[Dom Cruise]

Once again I don't think it's woke concessions, it's just a smokescreen for basically saying "We want women in our industry, either as consumers or designers, so we can market to women"

Look at these designers, all these are Men talking about their young daughters. If you read between the lines, all the feminist/woke talk is just, "we need women gamers, they spend the cash." Apparently all these people are talking about their young daughters, never their young sons.

I guess the hormone therapy will fix that.

Ver archivo adjunto 828208

Why can't they just say "because swimsuits look cool on female characters" or "women didn't fight in this war as a rule"?

Fucking cuck losers.

 

[V0dka]

Why can't they just say "because swimsuits look cool on female characters" or "women didn't fight in this war as a rule"?

Fucking cuck losers.

That doesn't play into the consumer message they are trying to send "Don't sexualize women, they are more than ornaments" "Women can do anything!" you are just turning away a far more profitable demographic by telling them things they don't want to hear.

 

[Dom Cruise]

That doesn't play into the consumer message they are trying to send "Don't sexualize women, they are more than ornaments" "Women can do anything!" you are just turning away a far more profitable demographic by telling them things they don't want to hear.

If they're such faggots that they can't handle a little sexy or can't understand history they don't deserve games to play.

Thing is though, many women don't find sexy offensive, as evidenced by so many female cosplayers, it's a bullshit stereotype and it's vocal minority should be ignored.

 

[V0dka]

Thing is though, many women don't find sexy offensive, as evidenced by so many female cosplayers, it's a bullshit stereotype and it's vocal minority should be ignored.

I don't know if it is a dumb stereotype or if it is the minority though, but the marketing teams apparently think the stereotype is a real thing. Emotional arguments in articles, Women seeing other Women as competition if they are too sexy. Anti-Male sentiment. Outrage clickbait.

Women wanting to see a representation of themselves in media was one I found interesting, because guys usually don't go "I want to see a skinnyfat guy in more movies saving the world. Where's basement dweller representation!" If the Man is charming and handsome and well built, Men think of it as something to aspire to, something that might motivate themselves to be better than they are. But I've found Women far more talk of wanting a sort of "self-insert" they want to empathize with the character, or have it represent them. Similar to the romance novels I was talking about eariler in the thread.

I think it's why Men get so confused when they see these new female characters, because they just seem so removed from reality. Either they are perfect in every way, or a passive macguffin for the male characters, but not too attractive as to alienate other Women from imagining being them. Because they are supposed to be the female power fantasy. The same one they accuse of Men having for male characters.

 

[UQ 770]

Why can't they just say "because swimsuits look cool on female characters" or "women didn't fight in this war as a rule"?

Fucking cuck losers.

I wouldn't mind more works with powerful female characters in them. Maybe I'm just the living embodyment of that joke where a dude is seen playing a female character in an RPG and when questioned on it he declares "I'd rather be staring at a girl's ass the whole time than a guys!". But the way they're going about it today is definitely the wrong way to do it and its totally full of shit. Fucking crap like Overwatch and Fortnite has demonstrated that total fantasy universes with almost no plot at all will attract players, so why not just create a gritty WW1-esque world where women being able to fight in those wars in the norm? Then again, I guess those games aren't very historically accurate anyway, look at the number of fucking machine guns and extremely rare pistols that showed up in Battlefield 1 just to make the game more like a modern FPS.

That doesn't play into the consumer message they are trying to send "Don't sexualize women, they are more than ornaments" "Women can do anything!" you are just turning away a far more profitable demographic by telling them things they don't want to hear.

I understand you're quoting the hypothetical mentality of a marketer here, but I could never understand this sentiment. Its been argued that having men with idealized bodies in fiction is just still just catering to men because "its a power fantasy" but like... women don't have power fantasies? Somehow? I'm beginning to lean heavily on the idea that I could out-market circles around these assholes on even a bad day. "And you get a power fantasy, and you get a power fantasy, and you get a power fantasy! Oh, you want an actual story? Right this way!"

 

[Fek]

https://youtu.be/6rQPDb-PJyI

That channel is quite the gem on the ol' Youtubes. Good pacing, addresses any/all major (and sometimes minor) woke talking points with well thought out (and expressed) counterpoints.

Gold star out of 10.

If they're such faggots that they can't handle a little sexy or can't understand history they don't deserve games to play.

Thing is though, many women don't find sexy offensive, as evidenced by so many female cosplayers, it's a bullshit stereotype and it's vocal minority should be ignored.

In my own experience - the way a woman reacts to seeing another woman trying to act sexy (especially in person) will immediately tell you how self confident she is (and, possibly, how far/fast to run..). If it's deeply offensive or troubling to her, then she's just a loser. Same thing if a dude shits himself over a better grade of man being appealing to his woman.

Now, a loser is more easily manipulated because they have no fucking spine to stand on their own morals/principles/merit/own two feet, right? They're just a wet goopy mess of insecurities. SO, if you had to market something, and you knew you had to do it deceptively in order to sell a shit load of it, which group would you focus on: The confident, or the losers? Which group would you try to "nuture" into expanding? I believe this is what @V0dka is striking at the heart of with their posts, or that was my (condensed) take on 'em.

I wouldn't mind more works with powerful female characters in them. Maybe I'm just the living embodyment of that joke where a dude is seen playing a female character in an RPG and when questioned on it he declares "I'd rather be staring at a girl's ass the whole time than a guys!". But the way they're going about it today is definitely the wrong way to do it and its totally full of shit.

<snip>

Its been argued that having men with idealized bodies in fiction is just still just catering to men because "its a power fantasy" but like... women don't have power fantasies? Somehow?

The classic female power fantasy involves getting the biggest baddest man she can vag-wrangle into doing what she wants him to do while being exceedingly desired by said badass man. The same scenario from the man's point of view is the basis for an absolute fuck load of stories both in and out of gaming (hell, look at fucking Mario..same deal). Men want to be the badass who gets the hot chick, and women want to be the hot chick who gets the badass. I'm not sure how you take this female power fantasy and turn it into a highly successful/marketable game without it ending up just being a visual novel that reads like smut your mom/grandmother has laying on a coffee table in her living room.

Now, of course that doesn't mean there aren't plenty of other tropes that men or women find more appealing than the other sex would (Candy Crush destroys my soul to even be near, but most women I've ever known to play it will spend hours engrossed in it). I just stuck to the oldest (probably biggest) example for the sake of argument, because, well.."power fantasy."

 

[UQ 770]

The classic female power fantasy involves

I keep hearing this line but what in the hell is it about estrogen that supposedly causes this desire? Isn't wanting an army of people to do shit for you or having a badass bodyguard also a pretty universal power fantasy? Sure if you want something done right you gotta do it yourself, but its also nice to sit back, put your feet up and have a drink while some unlucky bastard gets the task of doing the hard work for you.

 

[V0dka]

I keep hearing this line but what in the hell is it about estrogen that supposedly causes this desire? Isn't wanting an army of people to do shit for you or having a badass bodyguard also a pretty universal power fantasy? Sure if you want something done right you gotta do it yourself, but its also nice to sit back, put your feet up and have a drink while some unlucky bastard gets the task of doing the hard work for you.

I'd say its an evolutionary trait. If you are the "stronger sex", you are expected, and are the one that does out and do the life threatening duties, since you are more likely to succeed. If you are the "weaker sex", you are the one that takes care of other duties that while not life threatening, are still important, like securing the home and teaching and caring for the next generation.

It's all part of my theory that Men have evolved to work on an overt physical level, why they typically have better strength, speed, reaction times, and spatial awareness to Women. While Women are typically specialized in covert non-physical levels, social awareness, empathy, memory. Ever notice how whenever a Woman has a fight with a Man she's able to remember everything he's ever done wrong down to the finest detail and bring it all up like a barrage of machineguns? It's why Women have historically made the best spies.

 

[UQ 770]

I'd say its an evolutionary trait. If you are the "stronger sex", you are expected, and are the one that does out and do the life threatening duties, since you are more likely to succeed. If you are the "weaker sex", you are the one that takes care of other duties that while not life threatening, are still important, like securing the home and teaching and caring for the next generation.

It's all part of my theory that Men have evolved to work on an overt physical level, why they typically have better strength, speed, reaction times, and spatial awareness to Women. While Women are typically specialized in covert non-physical levels, social awareness, empathy, memory. Ever notice how whenever a Woman has a fight with a Man she's able to remember everything he's ever done wrong down to the finest detail and bring it all up like a barrage of machineguns? It's why Women have historically made the best spies.

Even if you're a dude though, don't you enjoy the idea of owning slaves a little? Of having laborers to do the hard work for you? Christ, even the term "Robot" is Czech for "serf" or "peasant".

 

[V0dka]

Even if you're a dude though, don't you enjoy the idea of owning slaves a little? Of having laborers to do the hard work for you? Christ, even the term "Robot" is Czech for "serf" or "peasant".

You're probably asking the wrong person.

 

[Sīn the Moon Daddy]

Even if you're a dude though, don't you enjoy the idea of owning slaves a little? Of having laborers to do the hard work for you? Christ, even the term "Robot" is Czech for "serf" or "peasant".

An assistant henchman would be nice.

 

[TenMilesWide]

Even if you're a dude though, don't you enjoy the idea of owning slaves a little? Of having laborers to do the hard work for you? Christ, even the term "Robot" is Czech for "serf" or "peasant".

Generally if we're talking about the male power fantasy, the impossibly ideal man to look up to in media, it's the guy who's of the mind that he should try to get everything done himself, and has the power to actually make that happen. He doesn't have or need anyone to get their hands dirty for him, he shoulders it all on his own.

Realistically you'd want to command people under you, sure, but power fantasies aren't about realism.

 

[escapegoat]

In which a bunch of supposedly observant incels just now noticed Mom does the grocery shopping and Walmart runs, same as Grandma did.

 

[UQ 770]

Generally if we're talking about the male power fantasy, the impossibly ideal man to look up to in media, it's the guy who's of the mind that he should try to get everything done himself, and has the power to actually make that happen. He doesn't have or need anyone to get their hands dirty for him, he shoulders it all on his own.

Realistically you'd want to command people under you, sure, but power fantasies aren't about realism.

Well, a common male power fantasy is being a high class, cynical corporate business owner with lots of underlings and the cash to buy their way out of everything. I suppose technically spending your own money on a service is "doing things yourself" but only by a pretty stretched version of that definition. Though maybe I'm interpreting that situation too literally.

 

[Sīn the Moon Daddy]

Well, a common male power fantasy is being a high class, cynical corporate business owner with lots of underlings and the cash to buy their way out of everything. I suppose technically spending your own money on a service is "doing things yourself" but only by a pretty stretched version of that definition. Though maybe I'm interpreting that situation too literally.

I feel like there's probably a few really archetypal fantasies.

Personally I'm the lone hero.
I don't need any backup dancers

 

[V0dka]

Well, a common male power fantasy is being a high class, cynical corporate business owner with lots of underlings and the cash to buy their way out of everything. I suppose technically spending your own money on a service is "doing things yourself" but only by a pretty stretched version of that definition. Though maybe I'm interpreting that situation too literally.

But do you imagine you are Tony Stark while watching Iron Man? Do you imagine you are Lex Luthor? I feel for Men there is a barrier there, you look at those characters and say you'd like to be more like them, but you don't typically self insert and think you ARE them, especially while watching the movie. I think Women though want characters they can immediately connect and empathize with in movies, in real time. Which is why you see these female characters Men are confused about, is she a Mary Sue? A Blank Slate? Why are all these guys fighting over this homely chick that barely does anything?

 

[UQ 770]

But do you imagine you are Tony Stark while watching Iron Man? Do you imagine you are Lex Luthor?

I guess I'm at my limit here since whatever form of dissociative problem I probably have prevents me from flat-out imagining myself as the person on the screen. I can identify with characters quite a bit, but I'm completely at a loss when people start talking beyond that. Same deal with "immersion" in vidya. I'd certainly love to be a guy with a ton of money or a monster that can bench-press a Mack truck or both or whatever, but I stop short of actually thinking of myself as any of those characters. Maybe someone can elaborate on this one and bridge that gap.

I think Women though want characters they can immediately connect and empathize with in movies, in real time.

This isn't a universal thing that people of any gender do? Christ, that's news to me.