Attempted Military Coup in Turkey Underway

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/15/turkey-low-flying-jets-and-gunfire-heard-in-ankara1/
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ankara-turkey-gunshot-military-coup-1.3681441
http://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/turkey/1.731225

Turkish military is caliming they;'ve taken control while the official government denies the announcements.

Yildirim says "it would be wrong to call it a coup" but that there has been an attempt by "part of the military".

He describes it as an "illegal attempt" to seize power.

Turkey would never allow any "initiative that would interrupt democracy", he said, and promised the perpetrators "will pay the highest price".

Earlier, military jets were heard flying over the capital, Ankara.

Media reports said ambulances were seen in front of the Turkey's military headquarters.

Istanbul's Bosphorus Bridge and Fatih Sultan Mehmet Bridge were both closed on Friday, local television channels reported.

A witness in the country’s capital told Reuters that gunshots were heard as military jets and helicopters were seen flying overhead. Witnesses in Istanbul, Turkey’s biggest city, also spotted helicopters overhead, the agency reported.

Latest updates also claim that internet and communications have been shut down, but it's unclear as to weather the military or government was responsible.

Also, hilariously enough, not even 4 months ago the Turkish Military threatened legal sanctions against those spreading "false rumors" they were planning a coup.

 

[fcgh vgcf]

in a surprising turn of events an islamic populace wants an islamic government and does NOT want a democratic one
more surprising, perplexing and outrageous news at 5

 

[RagtimeRoastBeefy]

And the turkish people cheer him on, while he plunges them back into the dark ages.

Oh lord no. This keeps coming up. Turks hate the guy, the elections are rigged and he's stayed in power forever through this. He has support on the right but he had the police shutting down support of the coup and a long history of detaining, arresting and marginalizing any opposition. The guy basically set it up so there can be no Kurdish influence in the government so he can kill them all. Erdogan is way more brutal and harsh than you give credit for. Westerners tend to be like "oh those people voted for this" and its actually no, there was mass voter suppression and mass political disenfranchisement that leads to essentially a one party system. What's dreadful is its going to get worse.

 

[DuskEngine]

Oh lord no. Turks hate the guy, the elections are rigged and he's stayed in power forever through this. He has support on the right but he had the police shutting down support of the coup and a long history of detaining, arresting and marginalizing any opposition. The guy basically set it up so there can be no Kurdish influence in the government so he can kill them all. Erdogan is way more brutal and harsh than you give credit for. Westerners tend to be like "oh those people voted for this" and its actually no, there was mass voter suppression and mass political disenfranchisement that leads to essentially a one party system. What's dreadful is its going to get worse

Yeah the AKP hasn't held a majority since last November. Erdogan's terms limits have run out too, he's only managed to remain in power the same way Putin has- by juggling the PM and presidency.

 

[glass_houses]

in a surprising turn of events an islamic populace wants an islamic government and does NOT want a democratic one
more surprising, perplexing and outrageous news at 5

I suspect that at least some of the people protesting against the rebelling soldiers were there not because they supported Erdogan, but as more of a, "Please, please stop. Things are bad enough as it is, don't give him anymore excuses to round yet more of us up and slaughter everyone."

 

[fcgh vgcf]

Yeah the AKP hasn't held a majority since last November. Erdogan's terms limits have run out too, he's only managed to remain in power the same way Putin has- by juggling the PM and presidency.

difference being that putin dosen't massacre his own people for not agreeing for him, he ''only'' kills the press so they can't trashtalk him a la western media v. rightwing parties

 

[Male Idiot]

difference being that putin dosen't massacre his own people for not agreeing for him, he ''only'' kills the press so they can't trashtalk him a la western media v. rightwing parties

He also does not outright support islamic right wing stuff.

 

[LiveFromNS]

Well, that was a poor excuse for a coup. It's time for Mr. Clean to cleanse the country!

 

[DuskEngine]

inb4 term limits are abolished

They were considering making those changes way back in 2014, I can't think of a better opportunity than this to force them through.

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

Well, that was a poor excuse for a coup. It's time for Mr. Clean to cleanse the country!Ver archivo adjunto 116087

This reeks of the Reichstags fire.
Doubt Erdogan instigated this coup, however the effect is the same, it seems.

 

[Dain Bramage]

Can't vote for any of the above because this "coup" smells of false flag from day one.

 

[Lorento]

So around 2,500 judges have been fired since this morning. And now arrest warrants have been issued for 140 members of the Supreme Court.

Erdogan is trying to take control of the judiciary using the coup as an excuse. Hello Reichstag Fire!

 

[Lorento]

Apologies for the double post, but a US statement just said this.

"Be advised that local authorities are denying movements on to and off of Incirlik Air Base. The power there has also been cut. Please avoid the air base until normal operations have been restored."

You read that right, Erdogan is cutting off bases the US are using to bomb ISIS. Is this a laughable attempt to force the US to extradite the cleric they claim is behind this?

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

Apologies for the double post, but a US statement just said this.

"Be advised that local authorities are denying movements on to and off of Incirlik Air Base. The power there has also been cut. Please avoid the air base until normal operations have been restored."

You read that right, Erdogan is cutting off bases the US are using to bomb ISIS. Is this a laughable attempt to force the US to extradite the cleric they claim is behind this?

Doubt it, Erdogan has pretty much no leverage, not even with the base, to achieve that. And pissing off the Americans, after having pissed off Russia and Germany, would be really stupid (then again, that would make it totally in line with Erdogans policy).

If that was the case, though, it would be hilarious to see Erdogan try and talk Obama into handing over that cleric.

PS: Wasn't this whole coup somehow linked to Incirlik Airbase? If so, it's only natural they take a close look at what's going on there and not allowing free movement to and from that Airbase.

 

[Dain Bramage]

Apologies for the double post, but a US statement just said this.

"Be advised that local authorities are denying movements on to and off of Incirlik Air Base. The power there has also been cut. Please avoid the air base until normal operations have been restored."

You read that right, Erdogan is cutting off bases the US are using to bomb ISIS. Is this a laughable attempt to force the US to extradite the cleric they claim is behind this?

If that happened, shit would be hitting the fan HARD! The US AND the other NATO nations wouldn't tolerate that sort of blackmail.

 

[DZ 305]

NATO wasn't going to like the outcome either way. Either we have Kebab who wants to be sultan double down and gain more government power, a loyal army and the love of the people. If he was removed, we would be left with a country of strategic value destabalized by his removal. I know the military handed back democratic control during the other coups, but something tells me it would either have to wait while civil unrest spreads and law and order breaks down.
If they did manage to restore peace enough to elect a new legitimate government, the public's behavior suggests they'd just hand it back over control to who ever Erdogen's party picked or whoever said they would continue his legacy. Hell, even if the president was a secularist, people vould just give Erdogen's party more seats in the legislature.

This is what makes these new dictatorships a pain in the ass. People like Putin and Erdogen don't have to worry the public will move against them. Give them bread for their bellies and circuses to keep them happy and you can get away with making yourself a king in everything but name.
It was a strategic choice that nobody wanted to make, but we had to make a choice considering how important they are to the US, EU, and NATO. If we supported the coup and it was crushed, Obama would be just trying to do Libya II. This could still turn into a mess if he purges and isnt ready for Daesh seeking to make up for lost territory and set up a new base of operations with fresh faces to brainwash. Either way leaves us with Islamists, but Erdogen is the only one we could hope to exert any control on.

 

[Lorento]

PS: Wasn't this whole coup somehow linked to Incirlik Airbase? If so, it's only natural they take a close look at what's going on there and not allowing free movement to and from that Airbase.

No matter the excuse, Erdogan is the same level of strongman that Putin is. While it might very well be in connection with the coup, it's also a message that if he so wanted, he could deny the US access to these airbases.

Granted, this would also mean that the US will take all the money they give to Turkey and pump it into a group that would be more willing to do business with them.

 

[IwegalBadnik]

Oh lord no. This keeps coming up. Turks hate the guy, the elections are rigged and he's stayed in power forever through this. He has support on the right but he had the police shutting down support of the coup and a long history of detaining, arresting and marginalizing any opposition. The guy basically set it up so there can be no Kurdish influence in the government so he can kill them all. Erdogan is way more brutal and harsh than you give credit for. Westerners tend to be like "oh those people voted for this" and its actually no, there was mass voter suppression and mass political disenfranchisement that leads to essentially a one party system. What's dreadful is its going to get worse.

The fact that people like Obama and Clinton have not even spoken out against Erdogan will like win over lots of angry Turks. People who suffered before/after/during this will resent their reactions (or if they generalize, the American reaction).

What that spells who knows...

NATO wasn't going to like the outcome either way. Either we have Kebab who wants to be sultan double down and gain more government power, a loyal army and the love of the people. If he was removed, we would be left with a country of strategic value destabalized by his removal. I know the military handed back democratic control during the other coups, but something tells me it would either have to wait while civil unrest spreads and law and order breaks down.
If they did manage to restore peace enough to elect a new legitimate government, the public's behavior suggests they'd just hand it back over control to who ever Erdogen's party picked or whoever said they would continue his legacy. Hell, even if the president was a secularist, people vould just give Erdogen's party more seats in the legislature.

Churchill has many quotes that sum up the problems of democracy. Time has not changed their applicability nor made them wrong.

This is what makes these new dictatorships a pain in the ass. People like Putin and Erdogen don't have to worry the public will move against them. Give them bread for their bellies and circuses to keep them happy and you can get away with making yourself a king in everything but name.

When people are weak and poor they tend to be malleable and milquetoast too.

 

[Grog]

If that happened, shit would be hitting the fan HARD! The US AND the other NATO nations wouldn't tolerate that sort of blackmail.

As long as the US keeps sucking on the oily tit of the Saudis they're going to tolerate everything that favors islamism.

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

NATO wasn't going to like the outcome either way. Either we have Kebab who wants to be sultan double down and gain more government power, a loyal army and the love of the people. If he was removed, we would be left with a country of strategic value destabalized by his removal. I know the military handed back democratic control during the other coups, but something tells me it would either have to wait while civil unrest spreads and law and order breaks down.
If they did manage to restore peace enough to elect a new legitimate government, the public's behavior suggests they'd just hand it back over control to who ever Erdogen's party picked or whoever said they would continue his legacy. Hell, even if the president was a secularist, people vould just give Erdogen's party more seats in the legislature.

This is what makes these new dictatorships a pain in the ass. People like Putin and Erdogen don't have to worry the public will move against them. Give them bread for their bellies and circuses to keep them happy and you can get away with making yourself a king in everything but name. It is better to pick the side of the favorite to win, otherwise if we backed the coup and lost, Obama would be just trying to do Libya II. This could still turn into a mess if he purges and isnt ready for Daesh seeking to make up for lost territory. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, but make sure to silently support or just not piss off the enemy of the the other two parties as a backup.

This really makes me wonder how weak-willed at heart some people like those in Turkey are. It's certainly no coincidence that a lot of muslim nations favor a strong-handed despot over a democratic leader. It seems they need some asshole on top of the pile to declare what's good and right, as they are unwilling to make certain hard decisions themselves. They crave someone to get rid of "impure" western influences for them.

Of course, there's always another layer of cultural, historical or social issues at hand. For instance, a huge reason why certain Afghans support local warlords is cause these people at least offer some sort of stability. They don't necessarily agree with the warlords goatfucking agenda, but they need him and his men to suppress other factions that would otherwise lead to armed conflict. However, it's still noticable how it's always the religious nutjobs that people flock to.

 

[DZ 305]

The fact that people like Obama and Clinton have not even spoken out against Erdogan will like win over lots of angry Turks. People who suffered before/after/during this will resent their reactions (or if they generalize, the American reaction).

What that spells who knows...



Churchill has many quotes that sum up the problems of democracy. Time has not changed their applicability nor made them wrong.



When people are weak and poor they tend to be malleable and milquetoast too.

I'm not justifying it. I know how hard the Turks fought for a westernize government over 80 years. I suspect that the fact they denounced the coup had to do with if we had good intel into if officers were in on the coup. That stuff shouldn't have escaped the intellegence community's attention. And if speculation is right, it looks like the coup failed because of disorganization. If so, communication either broke down in the military, or the conspiritors played their hand too early.
The only silver lining is that it is possible to maintain a secular, democratic institution in the Middle East, problem is we need to use the Turkish model and not the Iraqi model of let a civil war flare out into your fragile government that just recently lost the training wheels.