What killed the left?

[Luke Heaven 13!]

I wouldn't have said this 20 years ago, but they actually do hate America and everything it stands for.

The biggest would be the failure of the Soviet revolution. By the 60s the "left" was split into disillusioned intellectual types who saw that the U.S.S.R.'s "socialism" meant "social democracy at gunpoint," Stalinists ""Marxist-Leninists"" who had the job of explaining why Stalin executing every original Bolshevik was actually dialectical necessity, and Trotskyists who believed that if their axe-murdered Jewish messiah had won the power struggle then, somehow, the U.S.S.R. would be really socialist.

This is what The Red Decade by Eugene Lyons is all about. Basically everyone in high class from universities to populous cities viewed socialism as the cool chic thing to be and they were hardcore Stalinists. By the time the Cold War started they left it, and then severed ties when communists were being out in the 50s.

Make no mistake about it, that political class hated, and still hate, everyone underneath them. So when you talk about the pro-union American Left, this political class hated them as well because unions to them were for capitalists pigs.

Another point for this latest election was the legendary blunder of lying about Biden, then denying all evidence to his senility, then turning around with a "oops, he's fucked", and picking fucking Kamala of all people as a replacement candidate.

This will always be the Democratic downfall. Their obsession with power leads them to prop up a corpse for President because they just want to have control.

 

[The Dude]

Another thing that killed the Left is they now insist on taking the fringe/minority side of pretty much every issue. If there is an issue that like 70%, 80%, or even 90% of Americans will be against, they will take the position that the other 30%/20%/10% support. Look at the tranny issue. Most Americans do not support children undergoing gender transition and do not support biological men being allowed in womens sports or the same locker rooms as little girls simply because they claim they're really a woman. Most Americans want criminals caught, punished, and kept away from society. Most Americans do not want sexually explicit materials in school libraries. Most Americans don't support adults having sexual contact with minors. Yet more and more, these issues that only a small minority of Americans support are likewise gaining support from Democrats.

On a similar note, Dems/the Left will always oppose anything Donald Trump and the Republicans support, even if it's policies Democrats used to also support. Take tariffs for example. It wasn't long ago that Democrats supported tariffs. Even ol' Bern-bern Sanders was a fan of tariffs and spoke often of applying them liberally during his presidential runs. Dems uses to be solidly against open borders and illegal immigration. Dems used to be tough on crime and supported trying older teenagers as adults if they committed heinous crimes. Hillary Clinton spoke of "super predators". And look at how they've come out against gerrymandering, despite their past of gerrymandering every blue state pretty much as far as they could and now can't really squeeze out any more seats in their states. These are all things they are against now simply because Trump and the Republicans are for them.

Really, that's the big thing that has killed the DNC for the foreseeable future: they only have Trump hate to run on. Countering the Republicans and President Trump is all they have. They have no policies or plans that are attractive to the average American voter now. No kitchen table issues or ideas to help make life better for the average taxpayer. They have no platform other than "Trump bad!", and it just isn't jiving with the guy who works 60hrs a week and can't even afford to buy a decent car with low mileage, or the parents who would love to buy their own house to raise their kids in, but are barely making ends meet with both of them working full-time jobs and are both at risk of having some foreigner take their position because they'll work for less money.

 

[Itchy Hemorrhoids]

You people are retarded if you think Bernie isn’t a gigantic-woke trans affirming nigger worshipper. Look at his voting record and what he says and does. Look at him stand down when sheboons took over his stage.

 

[Smoltine Kiminal]

If there is an issue that like 70%, 80%, or even 90% of Americans will be against, they will take the position that the other 30%/20%/10% support.

but why would a political party that wants to win elections do this?
they certainly have analysts that tell them how many votes they can expect to lose or gain from certain stances, right?

 

[Frederica Bernkastel]

You people are retarded if you think Bernie isn’t a gigantic-woke trans affirming nigger worshipper. Look at his voting record and what he says and does. Look at him stand down when sheboons took over his stage.

He used to have unwoke opinions about guns and immigration, but other than that, yeah.

 

[Drain Todger]

but why would a political party that wants to win elections do this?
they certainly have analysts that tell them how many votes they can expect to lose or gain from certain stances, right?

People are still under the illusion that voting matters. Voting is like a toddler holding onto a fake Fisher-Price steering wheel and making vroom vroom noises in the passenger seat of a car and thinking that they're driving the car. All the really important decisions are handled by the Permanent State of technocrats with dashboards, CCTV cameras, performance metrics, and algorithms. Think "agile governance". The two-party system exists to give people an illusion of participation by voting for parties that hold diametrically opposed social and symbolic values. The Democrats and Republicans "perform" liberalism and republicanism just like a wrestler performs kayfabe.

The reason why we have culture wars over dumb, performative, symbolic cultural shit (i.e. hyperreality and simulacra) is so that we don't have political squabbles over the things of material substance that technocrats control (jobs/wages, financial regulations, infrastructure, trade, foreign policy, resources, housing, etc.). The technocrats arrange this Kabuki Theater specifically to sap people's energy and political will.

If you're spending all your time online arguing over whether men dressed up as women should use women's bathrooms, then you're not arguing about whether or not investment banks, commercial banks, and insurance companies should form huge conglomerates that are "too big to fail" that get a quantitative easing and bailout ass-pat on the taxpayer's dime every single time a debt bubble bursts. If you're spending all your time online arguing about gay marriage, then you're not arguing over whether or not it's okay for private equity firms to buy up successful companies they can't actually afford using leverage and then shitcan all the employees and sell off all the assets. If you're spending all your time online arguing about pornographic books in school libraries, then you're not arguing over whether or not it's okay to send billions of our tax dollars and state of the art weapons to Israel for them to pave Gaza flat.

See how this works? They don't care if you talk about things in Category A, so long as you never talk about things in Category B.

It literally doesn't matter who's in charge. The underlying program is the same. Problem, reaction, solution. The easiest way to see it is to just collapse the Republicans and Democrats into a singular "The Government".

The Government locked people down inside their homes for an extended period, and then, the Government mandated that everyone take poison so that they could come back out. The Government loosened border security to let in tons of illegals, and then, the Government proceeded to deport them all while vastly expanding the power of the Surveillance State with Palantir and Flock cameras everywhere.

It's not "Biden did this", or "Trump did that". Those are two puppets on the ends of an octopus's tentacles. One must learn to see the Octopus.

 

[Frederica Bernkastel]

The reason why we have culture wars over dumb, performative, symbolic cultural shit (i.e. hyperreality and simulacra) is so that we don't have political squabbles over the things of material substance that technocrats control (jobs/wages, financial regulations, infrastructure, trade, foreign policy, resources, housing, etc.). The technocrats arrange this Kabuki Theater specifically to sap people's energy and political will.

Cultural wars aren't really dumb, and aren't necessarily mutually exclusive to pursuing economic policy. Every major, political party the history of politics from the Nazis to the Bolsheviks pursue cultural wars to build support of their causes. Humans are not automatons that are solely invested in material needs, have preferences, and want purpose in life. Ecclesiastes would tell you as such. We wouldn't even be on Kiwifarms if the only thing we desired in life were material benefits.

People are still under the illusion that voting matters.

The quality of one's life is vastly different, especially in the U.S., because of voting patterns. You don't see people in Alabama struggling to find cheap housing as you do in California. There are political reasons for that.

 

[Frederica Bernkastel]

Engels justified the invasion of Mexico, by America, because he saw Mexicans as lazy and backwards, Trotsky said socialism would give rise to a Übermensch by unlocking the economic potential of men, Lenin stressed the need for socialism to create a new man willing to work for without remuneration for the greater needs of society, Che chastised niggers for being stupid and uncultured. Mao promoted socialist patriotism and Stalin opened the churches. Even the most materialist of political thinkers saw the need of fighting for a cultural baseline in life. Culture is pretty much our guide to action, and explains why people do what they do.

 

[Drain Todger]

Yes. But if material concerns have been pushed beyond the realm of political debate and handed to a permanent state of bureaucrats and credentialed experts, then the culture wars fundamentally act as a distraction. Technocrats don’t care what culture we have, so long as we shake the baby rattle of cultural debate while they maintain a death grip on the levers of material substance.

 

[ChefBourgeoisie]

but why would a political party that wants to win elections do this?

They painted themselves into a corner decades ago. Why would any Democrat constituent vote for a Democrat politician who suddenly turned MAGA? If they wanted to vote for such a person, they'd just vote Republican. So they can't pull a switcheroo, they're committed to their role. This is the practical side of it.

If we get to the principle side of things, it's no better. They can't switch because they are absolutely dedicated to the destruction of all that is good and decent. They've been trained since early childhood that "reality has a liberal bias" and that they can't be good people unless they're liberal. But the corollary of that is that if something is liberal, no matter how batshit insane that might be, it also means it is holy and righteous (in a very secular and Christianity-undermining way, of course).

These things cannot change. To even question why they cannot change is to mark oneself an evil Nazi, so they cannot question them.

 

[CowBoyCormack]

Another thing that killed the Left is they now insist on taking the fringe/minority side of pretty much every issue. If there is an issue that like 70%, 80%, or even 90% of Americans will be against, they will take the position that the other 30%/20%/10% support. Look at the tranny issue. Most Americans do not support children undergoing gender transition and do not support biological men being allowed in womens sports or the same locker rooms as little girls simply because they claim they're really a woman. Most Americans want criminals caught, punished, and kept away from society. Most Americans do not want sexually explicit materials in school libraries. Most Americans don't support adults having sexual contact with minors. Yet more and more, these issues that only a small minority of Americans support are likewise gaining support from Democrats.

On a similar note, Dems/the Left will always oppose anything Donald Trump and the Republicans support, even if it's policies Democrats used to also support. Take tariffs for example. It wasn't long ago that Democrats supported tariffs. Even ol' Bern-bern Sanders was a fan of tariffs and spoke often of applying them liberally during his presidential runs. Dems uses to be solidly against open borders and illegal immigration. Dems used to be tough on crime and supported trying older teenagers as adults if they committed heinous crimes. Hillary Clinton spoke of "super predators". And look at how they've come out against gerrymandering, despite their past of gerrymandering every blue state pretty much as far as they could and now can't really squeeze out any more seats in their states. These are all things they are against now simply because Trump and the Republicans are for them.

Really, that's the big thing that has killed the DNC for the foreseeable future: they only have Trump hate to run on. Countering the Republicans and President Trump is all they have. They have no policies or plans that are attractive to the average American voter now. No kitchen table issues or ideas to help make life better for the average taxpayer. They have no platform other than "Trump bad!", and it just isn't jiving with the guy who works 60hrs a week and can't even afford to buy a decent car with low mileage, or the parents who would love to buy their own house to raise their kids in, but are barely making ends meet with both of them working full-time jobs and are both at risk of having some foreigner take their position because they'll work for less money.

I'll push back/add a bit and say that sometimes it is good to take the position of protecting the minority, and that protecting the minority and the majority are not necessarily at odds with eachother.

I think its a key cornerstone of liberalism, but what I'm hinting at is the notion of individual rights, liberties, and freedoms. In some sense, the paradigm used to be 'protect the minority, and protect the majority- by preserving our individual rights'.

You don't want the tyranny of the mob stamping down on you, infringing upon your interests, voting away your rights, etc.

Something went wrong with the democrats though, in that they both ceased to fight for majority issues (such as tariffs), and also ceased to protect individual rights that benefitted everyone.

Most people can agree, what you do in your own bedroom is your own business, the state has little right to reach into there? Great, but the democrats took the worst of both positions in 'so now were going to force your kids to watch tranny parades with their dicks out in public and if you're not cool with this, youre a bigot'. Infringing upon both individual liberties, and forcing the nation to cater to the whims of a demographic thats not even 2% of the total US population.

But basically, every time the democrats over the past decade or so have had the chance to protect the minority/individual liberties (small businesses during covid, for example, the jab, etc), they completely shat on individual liberties that should be applied to all of society.

You could almost forgive some of the shitlib stuff, if they at least tried to protect these things, but even things such as free speech are under siege- so they completely lost the narrative.

 

[big pauper]

The Left has historically provided some support for people who need to work for a living. Preventing 14 year old kids from being forced to drop out of school to earn money for the family. They seem to have switched to forcing the populace into making expensive changes (health insurance, EV, gas stoves and furnaces, car seats) or personal intrusion such as vaccine and smart ID. And they have been arrogant and disrespectful about it. It's difficult to support a party that claims to be "educated" but resorts to name calling, cancelling, and general poopy pants emoting rather than trying to find some common ground or making progress on more neutral issues such as housing, jobs, health care.

the thing that's so bizarre is that 'the left' was so focused on these things that the shorthand term for left wing ideology used to be "labor." republicans were historically haughty rich assholes protecting business interests. But starting with, fuck, Reagan? there's legitimately been a flip flop where now Right wingers are focused on the common worker and Liberals are now haughty rich assholes.

It's all posturing, it's politics, it's mostly a ploy, but it means that you have people who still think of 'democrat/republican' in terms of 'jimmy carter/ronald reagan" who turn their nose up at you for voting for a crass businessman like trump yet are completely oblivious to the entire post-clinton political dynasty that systematically gutted everybody under the age of 45's positive opinions of the democratic party by turning it into the party of shareholder talking point that nobody will remember in 6 months, backed up by a gaggle of screeching harpies.

 

[The Dude]

Engels justified the invasion of Mexico, by America, because he saw Mexicans as lazy and backwards

He was right, but that's why America should not invade Mexico to take control of it. The only way invading and taking control of Mexico makes any sense for America would be to also drive out everyone living IN Mexico. Otherwise the Mexicans just become even more of a problem for America than they already are with all the illegals. If Mexico were to become a 51st state as it were, it should only be done if all the Mexicans are run out of the country or eliminated. We don't need to willingly make them a burden on us.

They painted themselves into a corner decades ago. Why would any Democrat constituent vote for a Democrat politician who suddenly turned MAGA? If they wanted to vote for such a person, they'd just vote Republican. So they can't pull a switcheroo, they're committed to their role. This is the practical side of it.

It really depends on the Dem. If it's an RFK or Tulsi Gabard situation where they're making the switch because they truly believe it's the right thing to do and the DNC has totally lost their way, then why not keep voting for them? They're standing up for their convictions and beliefs. If it's clear they're only doing it for opportunistic reasons, then no. Do not vote for them.

 

[DSHK]

The right is as in as strong a position as it was in the 1980s and 1990s. What killed the Republicans winning streak was the Iraq war which played a huge part in radicalizing left wing millennials and thereby creating things like the new atheist movement(fortunately all it took was a banana to bring it down). The 2008 recession was just the final nail in the coffin. This is why the right now holds the anti war position. They dont want to start another unpopular war that will cost them what couldve been a 30 year winning streak. The Ukraine war also did to Europe what the oil crisis did to us in the 70s. Now that they need to rearm and pay for more expensive energy they can kiss their gay socialist welfare systems goodbye. As long as the republican party is able to keep us out of a major foreign conflict they will be around for a long time and the left will experience the biggest buttfucking theyve had since Reagan. They know this which is why theyre all freaking the fuck out. The democrats are in a pickle because they are stuck between going far left and alienating their moderate voters and large corporate donors or going more centrist and alienating the democratic socialist progressive faction. Their plan seems to be throwing sodomites under the bus and focusing strictly on economic issues from what I can tell.

 

[Dendyy]

If you're spending all your time online arguing over whether men dressed up as women should use women's bathrooms, then you're not arguing about whether or not investment banks, commercial banks, and insurance companies should form huge conglomerates that are "too big to fail" that get a quantitative easing and bailout ass-pat on the taxpayer's dime every single time a debt bubble bursts. If you're spending all your time online arguing about gay marriage, then you're not arguing over whether or not it's okay for private equity firms to buy up successful companies they can't actually afford using leverage and then shitcan all the employees and sell off all the assets. If you're spending all your time online arguing about pornographic books in school libraries, then you're not arguing over whether or not it's okay to send billions of our tax dollars and state of the art weapons to Israel for them to pave Gaza flat.

 

[Drag-on Knight 91873]

Their plan seems to be throwing sodomites under the bus and focusing strictly on economic issues from what I can tell.

This is what I rate as optimistic. Dem cities are embarrassing hives of poverty and crime even without the DEI mayors running it.

 

[skykiii]

What killed the left?
"I," said the sparrow.
"With my little arrow.
I killed the left."

Who caught it's blood?
"I," said the fish,
"With my little dish,
I caught it's blood."

 

[Sweetpeaa]

The right is as in as strong a position as it was in the 1980s and 1990s. What killed the Republicans winning streak was the Iraq war which played a huge part in radicalizing left wing millennials and thereby creating things like the new atheist movement(fortunately all it took was a banana to bring it down). The 2008 recession was just the final nail in the coffin. This is why the right now holds the anti war position. They dont want to start another unpopular war that will cost them what couldve been a 30 year winning streak. The Ukraine war also did to Europe what the oil crisis did to us in the 70s. Now that they need to rearm and pay for more expensive energy they can kiss their gay socialist welfare systems goodbye. As long as the republican party is able to keep us out of a major foreign conflict they will be around for a long time and the left will experience the biggest buttfucking theyve had since Reagan. They know this which is why theyre all freaking the fuck out. The democrats are in a pickle because they are stuck between going far left and alienating their moderate voters and large corporate donors or going more centrist and alienating the democratic socialist progressive faction. Their plan seems to be throwing sodomites under the bus and focusing strictly on economic issues from what I can tell.

I agree about that being the right is anti war. You are right.

 

[big pauper]

This is what I rate as optimistic. Dem cities are embarrassing hives of poverty and crime even without the DEI mayors running it.

The whole parlay was to turn those cities into progressive strongholds to attract people from the rest of the country but the gravy train ran out a long time ago so now those cities are full of crime. They're going to play the economic angle as best as they can but they're going to be forced into paying for dumb shit like gay immigrant outreach because that's the voter base they've spent the last 15 years cultivating

 

[Ser Prize]

Most people can agree, what you do in your own bedroom is your own business, the state has little right to reach into there?

But that ended up being a big fat lie. We went from "We just want to get married" to "Bake the cake bigot" within like a fucking year. And now you're a homophobe if you don't actively worship at the feet of gay people.