Trump addresses government shutdown and border security


"Some have suggested a barrier is immoral. Then why do wealthy politicians build walls, fences, and gates around their homes? They don't build walls because they hate the people on the outside, but because they love the people on the inside."

build wall :wall:

I think I need to actually post an article as well so here's some shit from WSJ
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-addresses-nation-on-border-wall-as-shutdown-drags-on-11546999648
WASHINGTON—President Trump in a prime-time address Tuesday said a wall along the southern border is key to national security, as he called for lawmakers to fund it and end a partial government shutdown that is days away from becoming the longest in U.S. history.

In the televised address from the Oval Office, Mr. Trump’s first in his nearly two years as president, he said a barrier is necessary to prevent the movement of illegal drugs across the U.S.-Mexico border, and he shared stories of human trafficking.

“This is a humanitarian crisis—a crisis of the heart and a crisis of the soul,” said Mr. Trump, sitting at the Resolute Desk. “This is the cycle of human suffering that I am determined to end.”

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi of California and Sen. Chuck Schumer of New York, the Democratic congressional leaders, issued an immediate televised response to the president, rejecting the idea of a wall as unnecessary.

“President Trump must stop holding the American people hostage, must stop manufacturing a crisis, and must reopen the government,” Mrs. Pelosi said.

Mr. Schumer said Democrats are united with the president on the need for stronger border security, but said: “We sharply disagree with the president about the most effective way to do it.”

Earlier Tuesday, Senate Democrats blocked the chamber from considering bipartisan foreign-policy legislation in a bid to pressure Republicans to end the government shutdown, which was in its 18th day. That move, combined with Mr. Trump’s address, suggested that neither side was prepared to cede ground over wall funding.

Mr. Trump and congressional leadership from both parties are scheduled to meet and discuss the issue Wednesday at the White House, after the president attends a lunch with Senate Republicans on Capitol Hill.

Mr. Trump’s address was part of a ramped-up effort by the White House this week to sway public opinion in favor of a border wall, a core issue for Mr. Trump’s political base but one that is broadly unpopular. On Thursday, the Republican president is set to travel to the border to highlight the issue in person.

A Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll in September, ahead of midterm elections, showed 29% of respondents said they would be more likely to vote for a congressional candidate calling for a wall, while 55% said they would be less likely to do so.

In his address, Mr. Trump didn’t declare a national emergency over border security—a move he publicly contemplated in recent days—in which he would seek to divert funds from elsewhere in the government to fund the wall. Such a declaration would bring swift legal challenges, and it is unclear in that scenario where the funds would come from.

Instead, the speech was aimed at explaining the president’s rationale for why he viewed the U.S.-Mexico border as in a state of crisis.

Mr. Trump has said he wouldn’t sign any bill ending the shutdown that doesn’t allocate money for hundreds of miles of a border wall.

Earlier Tuesday evening, Senate Democrats prevented the chamber from moving to consider a package of bills aimed at boosting security assistance for Israel and other Middle Eastern policy provisions. Republicans hold 53 seats in the Senate, where most bills need 60 votes to clear procedural hurdles.

Some Democrats have said they would block all legislation until the government is reopened, though Mr. Schumer hasn’t gone that far.

“The first business of the Senate should be to reopen the government,” said Sen. Tim Kaine (D., Va.), noting that he had co-sponsored one of the bills related to Israel. “As passionate as I have been for the security of the nation of Israel, I’m every bit as passionate about the security of the United States.”

The president’s apparent backing off on declaring an emergency comes after lawmakers in both parties indicated they wouldn’t support such a move. Rep. Mac Thornberry of Texas, the top Republican on the House Armed Services Committee, said Tuesday that he opposes using an emergency declaration to build a wall using military funds.

President Trump and prominent Democrats met Friday to discuss ending the government shutdown, which the president had claimed responsibility to further the cause border security. The talks were described by the president as productive, but the Democrats disagreed. Photo: AP
“In short, I’m opposed to using defense dollars for nondefense purposes,” he said.

Senior White House adviser Kellyanne Conway said in a Fox News interview Monday that the White House Counsel’s Office was exploring the legal implications of declaring a national emergency, but said doing so would “let Congress off the hook.”

In preparation for Tuesday’s speech, White House officials were underscoring the importance of internally fact-checking any numbers and statistics, after the president and his aides have repeatedly mischaracterized immigration-related figures in recent weeks. “It’s really important we get this right,” one senior White House official said.

The president has made points about problems with drugs and human trafficking at the border publicly in the past week. Last week, he told cabinet members that 300 people in the U.S. die each day from overdoses of heroin, “the vast majority of which comes across through our southern border.” The federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said the epidemic of daily opioid deaths is 130.

Mr. Trump also has said 20,000 children were smuggled into the U.S. last month. There were 25,000 families apprehended at the border in November, according to the most recent data available from U.S. Customs and Border Protection.

During closed-door negotiations on reopening the government, Mrs. Pelosi has disputed some White House aides’ statistics about the border. On Sunday, White House press secretary Sarah Sanders was challenged on Fox News for saying 4,000 known or suspected terrorists have been apprehended coming into the country.

“Do you know where those 4,000 people come, where they are captured?” Chris Wallace, the host of “Fox News Sunday,” told Ms. Sanders. “Airports … the State Department says there hasn’t been any terrorists found coming across the southern border.” Mr. Wallace was referring to data from the Department of Homeland Security.

Ms. Conway, in the Fox News interview, said that statistic “got unfortunately conflated by a colleague” and acknowledged that the nearly 4,000 terrorists or terror suspects apprehended in fiscal year 2017 hadn’t sought to enter the U.S. through the southern border.

The administration has sought in recent days to blunt the impact of the shutdown, buying time as negotiations with Congress continue. On Monday, the Trump administration said the Internal Revenue Service would pay tax refunds even though the agency is closed, reversing a longstanding policy.

About 420,000 employees deemed essential are working without pay, while another 380,000 federal employees have been placed on unpaid leave. The shutdown became the second-longest on record Monday. By Saturday, if the government hasn’t reopened, the shutdown will become the longest in U.S. history.
 
Última edición:
I do hope the Democrat Congress caves in soon to President Trump's ultimatum. It's been more than 10 business days since I ordered the 2018 tax forms from IRS, and I'm still waiting on delivery and no one is answering the phone to give me an ETA when I call IRS. Corporate tax returns for 2018 are due at the end of the month :stress:.
Jokes on you for trying to be a capitalist.
 
I disagree with you on many points, and I think you're misguided or misinformed in a lot of your thinking about this topic.
That said, I retract my earlier post implying that you're being insincere/don't believe what you're saying. The situation, as we respectively see it, is vastly different.
It's been said ad infinitum, both in this thread and elsewhere, but it bears repeating: the construction of a wall-like structure among the most vulnerable areas of our southern border is necessary, but not sufficient, to begin to tackle the issues of border security and illegal immigration.
The best time to start handling this problem was 50 years ago, the next best time is NOW NOW NOW *sigh*

I appreciate the sentiment and your passion on the subject. Perhaps you're right, maybe I'm not looking at this as complete as it should be. A lot of people here disagree with me, but strangely enough I looked back at their points and figured: Maybe they are on to something as well. More than our current government. The one thing I stand on definitely is that we can't get anywhere without proper discussion and cooperation.

As @Just Some Other Guy pointed out, upholding existing laws on top of a stronger border is something that can work out.
 
Look at these sliemballs. This isn't even a fact-check. It's a narrative spin.

1547121883051.jpg
 
Look at these sliemballs. This isn't even a fact-check. It's a narrative spin.

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While that is true, they always ignore that deaths caused by illegals could have been prevented...if existing laws were enforced. Some guy (like the Las Vegas shooter) having a clean record and then shooting some people up one day can't be prevented if there was nothing to tip someone off. It's a tragedy. Crimes caused by illegals are infuriating because they should have never happened.

Also media, please stop conflating illegals with my wife by calling both "immigrants", that is especially irritating.
 
I’m fine with no wall but in exchange we need mandatory E-Verify, no welfare for illegals, fine businesses for hiring illegals, etc. It will never happen, which is why the wall is needed as a starting point. Democrats are against everything I proposed as well because they want a horde of brown voters to take over critical states for the GOP like Texas, Florida, etc.

The Democrats haven’t provided a viable alternative because they want open borders and won’t consider anything else.
 
why would trump lie about mexico buying the wall?
CatParty we all know you like your one-sentence hot takes that no one else ever thought of before. But at some point you have to start thinking about the fact that all of America has accepted as fact for many decades that all politicians make bullshit promises regardless of who we vote for, including Trump's modern opponents. So "but Trump said Mexico would pay for it" isn't a motivating argument to millions of people who still like what Trump is doing better than what they would get from the democrats. No matter how many times over two years and change now it has been said to us as though it must be the first time we're hearing it.

Yeah, yeah, honeypot.gif, I know.
 
it does stop cars and trucks from simply driving across though

while a plain wall is indeed possible to overcome, it still slows down and inconveniences trespassers a lot. this effect can be increased further by adding additional layers of defense to the fortification: trenches, razor wire, caltrops, landmines (if you're feeling really edgy that day), etc.
add guard towers, cameras, and surveillance drones covering the border area, and it becomes nearly impossible to slip through the border without being noticed and intercepted by law enforcement.
The costs of that would be staggering and, sure, it'd stop the immigrants who run across the borders, but not the ones who overstay their visas and just sit in the U.S. The wall will never stop those people, since they'd just walk right on through.

What we should do instead is make a push towards increasing chances for legal immigration and proper screening, so that we can register and tax them like everyone else in the country.
 
Would it be a paradox if the wall got green light to be built but they couldn't get the illegals for the cheap labor?
It's a damn shame that all of our manufacturing jobs and whatnot got shipped off to foreign countries in the name of corporate interests.

So we'd have to pay China for the Wall, as well as tons of corporate contractors, and that money's going straight up to the elite. Honestly, I'm surprised there aren't conspiracy theories about how Trump is calling for the wall to diversify his stock holdings. He's certainly a scummy enough person to blow tons of federal money on his own interests like every other elected official in our bloated, inept, inbred, oligarchical clusterfuck of a system.
 
The costs of that would be staggering and, sure, it'd stop the immigrants who run across the borders, but not the ones who overstay their visas and just sit in the U.S. The wall will never stop those people, since they'd just walk right on through.

What we should do instead is make a push towards increasing chances for legal immigration and proper screening, so that we can register and tax them like everyone else in the country.
500k illegal border crossings each year is quite a lot though even if more people stay through overstay visas

As for the cost, what's the problem with spending 5 billion a year on a border wall when you spend the same amount a year to cause a civil war that goes nowhere or the same amount each year to ensure the citizens of Detroit don't go full Fallout?
 
CatParty we all know you like your one-sentence hot takes that no one else ever thought of before. But at some point you have to start thinking about the fact that all of America has accepted as fact for many decades that all politicians make bullshit promises regardless of who we vote for, including Trump's modern opponents. So "but Trump said Mexico would pay for it" isn't a motivating argument to millions of people who still like what Trump is doing better than what they would get from the democrats. No matter how many times over two years and change now it has been said to us as though it must be the first time we're hearing it.

Yeah, yeah, honeypot.gif, I know.

i'm just sayin i don't want to pay for no one's vanity project. if he can do it without it effecting our money, great
 
500k illegal border crossings each year is quite a lot though even if more people stay through overstay visas

As for the cost, what's the problem with spending 5 billion a year on a border wall when you spend the same amount a year to cause a civil war that goes nowhere or the same amount each year to ensure the citizens of Detroit don't go full Fallout?

I've looked at the numbers and that's less than half the total number considering there are some ~700k overstays a year, so the Wall would solve less than half the problem while continuing the problem of exploitation of labor laws and a lack of taxes. By making legal immigration easier and funding "how to be an American" courses, we could theoretically cut illegal immigration, have migrants be better suited to the U.S, and be able to tax them.

The fact of the matter is this: I've come to the opinion that both the Democrat and Republican parties are full of shit and need to be replaced with new blood. No identity politics or science denial, I just want policies that improve infrastructure, disentangle the U.S's energy from Saudi Arabia, and rework the school systems.
 
i'm just sayin i don't want to pay for no one's vanity project. if he can do it without it effecting our money, great
Fair enough. Although I think the money argument has been drummed up into kind of a red herring given how much other crap we routinely waste billions on annually. I wish the talking heads would talk more about this shutdown since it's already cost like 5 times as much money as the wall would and will only continue to cost more, but shutdowns are one of those things both parties can agree on how to deal with, since they're both playing chicken and claiming it's only the other guy at fault.
 
Hungary, Turkey, Israel, the Koreas (if you don't call that a wall, you're mistaken), I believe Romania has some border wall, Spain....

Egypt has a border wall with Palestine. That one gets(intentionally) overlooked quite often.

The India-Pakistan border fence is so extensive that you can see the line of Indian's floodlights that light the border from space at night.

India does a pretty damn good job of keeping the Pakistanis(some of thee most ravenous savages of Earth) out with their border security fences, walls and methods. And it's a crazy-long border.
 
Give me a unicorn too while we’re at it
I will give you something better: moon colonies and genetically engineered unicorns.

Okay, maybe the moon colonies first, but we could theoretically splice either narwhal or rhinoceros genes into a horse and see what happens.

Vote Dr. W 2020, because why the fuck not trust some douchebag on the Farms.
 
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