Paganism vs Abrahamic Debates

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Saldar_

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27 de Abr, 2026
Every time I come across those Paganism vs Abrahamic Religions debates and discussions on X, there is one thing which both sides do that bothers me, and really turns the entire debate into some Strawman.

Those who follow Abrahamic Religions have a specific conceptualization of God and the divine, so they then project that same conceptualization onto Paganism and judge it by Abrahamic standards. Like do Pagans really believe in the Gods, do they have specific dogmas, is there an afterlife to look forward to etc. Like yeah, when you look at Paganism through this Abrahamic lens, of course it looks like complete LARP.

But Paganism operates on an entirely different metaphysical foundation. And in order to properly understand it you need to stop thinking Abrahamically. From what I personally learned through my own research (if there are any Pagans here, please correct me if I am wrong), is that you don't need to LITERALLY believe in Zeus, Jupiter, Odin, and any other deity to be a Pagan. Pagan Gods are best understood as centers of values. Each God embodies a cluster of values, virtues, and ways of being human. Like Apollo represents light, reason, and beauty, while Ares represents martial courage, then Dionysus represents ecstasy and so on.

They are merely manifestations of these different values. Gods and their myths may fade, but the values they embody remain. And to Pagans what matters is reconnecting with those values and the philosophy of life they expressed. You don't need to literally pray to them, you can be Pagan as a philosophical and spiritual orientation without performing any rituals or adopting any supernatural beliefs. And this kind of concept can utterly buckbreak those with an Abrahamic conception of the divine.

And to also be fair, Pagans do tend to do this themselves, They like to shit on the Abrahamic religions for being Universalist (which is a sentiment I tend to agree with tbh) but they are not willing to put themselves in the shoes of Christians and Muslims and see the world through their eyes in order to understand how they think, so really all they can do is go "Haha jew on a stick."

And really, I think this just ties into my own broad opinion that religious discourse is often more rigid and polarizing than political discourse. When religion is being discussed or debated, it is rarely just about comparing different ideas or perspectives. The discussion is framed as a struggle between ultimate good and ultimate evil, between God and Satan. Because you believe your stance to be divinely sanctioned, there is a natural tendency to treat opposing views not simply as “wrong” but as dangerous, even threatening to the eternal wellbeing of others. That kind of thing creates a powerful incentive to demonize those who disagree, regardless of whether one’s position can be defended as objectively true or not. Because people's souls and salvation are at stake depending on what they take from the discussion/debate.

As an example, when people are on the defensive about their own religious beliefs, they will pull every kind of charity imaginable to justify their position (Like "Oh but there are different interpretations of that verse" or similar), but they are unwilling to give any of that charity when the situation is exactly the same on the opponent's side. And as an Agnostic who loves learning about different spiritual traditions, I always hated it when I saw things devolving into that, so I guess I just kinda felt like venting here.
 

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But Paganism operates on an entirely different metaphysical foundation. And in order to properly understand it you need to stop thinking Abrahamically. From what I personally learned through my own research (if there are any Pagans here, please correct me if I am wrong), is that you don't need to LITERALLY believe in Zeus, Jupiter, Odin, and any other deity to be a Pagan. Pagan Gods are best understood as centers of values. Each God embodies a cluster of values, virtues, and ways of being human. Like Apollo represents light, reason, and beauty, while Ares represents martial courage, then Dionysus represents ecstasy and so on.
What do you need to be a pagan for then? This sounds quite pointless.
 
What do you need to be a pagan for then? This sounds quite pointless.
Boredom. They're not "pagans" per se, they're applying the concept of secular Judaism to other ethnic groups because they like the experience of having a religion but don't like what a monotheistic religion has symbolized. It's a category of religion that's only possible in a post-enlightenment liberal democracy.
 
But Paganism operates on an entirely different metaphysical foundation. And in order to properly understand it you need to stop thinking Abrahamically. From what I personally learned through my own research (if there are any Pagans here, please correct me if I am wrong), is that you don't need to LITERALLY believe in Zeus, Jupiter, Odin, and any other deity to be a Pagan. Pagan Gods are best understood as centers of values. Each God embodies a cluster of values, virtues, and ways of being human. Like Apollo represents light, reason, and beauty, while Ares represents martial courage, then Dionysus represents ecstasy and so on.
That is the modern interpretation of Paganism and that version is for people who aren't serious. The Sixteen Sedian Tenets describes a serious Germanic heathen religion.
 
If Paganism was correct then the last bastions of Pagans wouldn't have been people who eat humans/cow dung.

Doesn't help that most Pagan religions are only known because Christians took the time to document them, and even then it's often polluted with an Abrahamic world view that was never in the original beliefs.

Pagan Gods are best understood as centers of values. Each God embodies a cluster of values, virtues, and ways of being human.
What value does Zeus represent? "You can rape women freely when you're in a top position as long as your wife doesn't catch you"?
 
What value does Zeus represent? "You can rape women freely when you're in a top position as long as your wife doesn't catch you"?
Zeus represents the Ancient Greek ideal of the family Patriarch. He is the Storm incarnate. Mighty beyond reproach, but ultimately doomed to end, as he ended the old order of the world. There's a reason Typhon is tied to a volcano. A storm does not care what you think, it simply is and will destroy everything around it regardless of moral standing. He did X thing because the arbiters and heads of Ancient Greek society did those things and deemed them appropriate. It was after all, their values and ideas that helped their society evolve beyond being simple hunter gatherers and recover from the Bronze Age Collapse.
I'm not saying these are good or bad values. They simply were what people did in their time and environment.
 
But Paganism operates on an entirely different metaphysical foundation. And in order to properly understand it you need to stop thinking Abrahamically. From what I personally learned through my own research (if there are any Pagans here, please correct me if I am wrong), is that you don't need to LITERALLY believe in Zeus, Jupiter, Odin, and any other deity to be a Pagan. Pagan Gods are best understood as centers of values. Each God embodies a cluster of values, virtues, and ways of being human. Like Apollo represents light, reason, and beauty, while Ares represents martial courage, then Dionysus represents ecstasy and so on.
Cope and seethe harder, motherfucker.
Nobody gives a shit what you or your drunkard asshole uncle believes after a few pints of acid.
If you believe in virtues, then fucking live by them instead of adapting some Marvel hero bullshit and ritual forest orgy tripping balls nonsense like some fucking retard. And if you want to take drugs, just take drugs and shut the fuck up about your acid trips. Nobody gives a fuck.
The fucking gal of pagans to screech metaphysics and higher theology when it's purely because of Christianity you have any academic interest about it to begin with because your ancestors were either too illiterate or too drunk to keep the tradition going in a steady pace.
So fuck off.
 
Rate me dumb all you want but who cares, it's like arguing polytheistic Hinduism vs monotheistic Zoroastrianism, if you didn't believe in these things or were raised in a culture were people barely heard of paganism and barely had contact with christians you would think it's silly to debate which made up thing is better (tips fedora); dudes talking about if a pantheon of made up things that are the embodiment of the wisdom and values of their ancestors codified in a religion is better than having one single, super powerful, made up thing, that is also the embodiment of the wisdom and values of their ancestors

:neckbeard:
 
All I have seen of this topic is retarded white aryan nazi larpers on x who only mention Christians and Jesus without ever mentioning muslims or judaism even the term abrahamic is very lazy because there is big difference between islam Christianity and Judaism

There is also reddit pagans who are pro lgbt troons and brown the opposite of the 1488 x edgelords it has to be one of the dumbest of movements with no real world presence
 
There’s a reason the philosophers were starting to worship universal onenesses and unmoved movers and perfectly round spheres and stuff and not Odin and Zeus
To put this in terms even a cum skinned barbarian can understand, imagine like the best stick or rock you can, the most stickish or rock-like rock you can. Now imagine that with like goodness and boom you’ve got God
 
Nigga, I chopped down your tree with ax. Nigga, I sent your Pagan temples and light nigga, that means my God is wheeling your goddess, not nigga. Jesus is your Lord and savior. He gives water to wine. He's a drink exchanger cause Jesus Christ is my nigga.
 
I'm pretty sure most pagan people in the past believed that the gods were literally real. A subsistence farmer does not sacrifice a precious goat to a concept for funsies, he sacrifices it to a real god so that said god will be appeased and hopefully grant him a boon, or at the very least not actively fuck him over. Like, talk to some practicing Hindus, who are really the only continuous example of Indo-European polytheism still extant in the modern world in a continuous line to time immemorial. I'm pretty sure most of them genuinely believe their gods are real and demand worship from humans.

This is precisely why modern neo-paganism gets called a larp. Connecting with a Greek god associated with traits you admire but that you don't really believe is real and will respond to your prayers isn't all that different than me connecting to a fictional character from an anime or a movie that I think embodies admirable traits.
 
I'm pretty sure most pagan people in the past believed that the gods were literally real. A subsistence farmer does not sacrifice a precious goat to a concept for funsies, he sacrifices it to a real god so that said god will be appeased and hopefully grant him a boon, or at the very least not actively fuck him over. Like, talk to some practicing Hindus, who are really the only continuous example of Indo-European polytheism still extant in the modern world in a continuous line to time immemorial. I'm pretty sure most of them genuinely believe their gods are real and demand worship from humans.

This is precisely why modern neo-paganism gets called a larp. Connecting with a Greek god associated with traits you admire but that you don't really believe is real and will respond to your prayers isn't all that different than me connecting to a fictional character from an anime or a movie that I think embodies admirable traits.
I like to picture it being a lot like Christianity.

You've got dumb motherfuckers that believe there's really a dude namde Zeus sitting upon that mountain even though Nicolas hiked up it last week and there was nothing up there. These are your Young Earth Creationists.

You've got middle-brow liberal Christian equivalents that know common sense says that Zeus isn't on Mount Olympus for real/Noah's Ark clearly isn't real but they'll still swallow it in general because they don't really think it through that much anyways.

Then you've got giga-chad theologian types, this'd be your philosophers, who do what that guy was talking about, this is mostly allegories, fables intended for moral instruction, stuff like that that's layered around our recognition that the universe is alive and is driven by real forces and principles and you can parlay with these forces of nature.

But I think it absolutely would have started with the dumb motherfuckers and each layer is more abstraction being added on over it as people think through how stupid this shit is until they get to the original concept that is actually closer to the philosopher/theologian than it ever was to the folk version.
 
As an aside, I will just say it always felt like lumping all Judaism, Christianity, and Islam into a single category like "Abrahamic" always felt like cop-out; even just a cursory look into them would show a pretty massive disparity on things like morals, archaeology, philosophy, and interpretation of scripture (especially Islam, which already has a very shaky history). It makes it far too easy to attack Christianity when you can just point to the failings of Islam and say "see this is why Abrahamic religions can't work".

You also have way too many assumptions in your OP about Christianity. What does thinking "Abrahamically" even mean? You haven't defined a lot of your terms.

I think this just ties into my own broad opinion that religious discourse is often more rigid and polarizing than political discourse.

As it should be. The problem with relativistic philosophy is that you end up breaking down what makes a thought system unique and you just end up with indefensible gobbildy-gook. Why can't Christians lean on their understanding of scripture? You want Christians to remove themselves from their epistemologies, but seem to be unwilling to come out of yours.
 
Abrahamic religions are Jewish political systems in disguise and comes from the same Jewish roots. It is infailible in its very root and the reason why Globalists and Communists almost always win over Gentiles. It wouldn't be that bad if their goal isn't to force EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE ENTIRE WORLD to bend over to their will, which is obviously the case here.

You do not see Gentile/Pagan religions forcing you to believe that Zeus or Enlil are infailible, all loving and all-tolerant and punishing you with death if you believe in the contrary in the same way the Jews do. Not even Jeets force you to worship Shiva and Vishnu (because modern Jeets have only one religion and that religion is Globalism).




As an aside, I will just say it always felt like lumping all Judaism, Christianity, and Islam into a single category like "Abrahamic" always felt like cop-out; even just a cursory look into them would show a pretty massive disparity on things like morals, archaeology, philosophy, and interpretation of scripture (especially Islam, which already has a very shaky history).
Their beliefs might be heavily divergent, but ultimately they are all diverged from the same Jewish roots history-wise and all of them believe that they are the best with no room for agument or leeway and have a very black and white view on things.

This naturally means that these religions are seedbeds for the worst sort of violence imaginable, things like the Taliban, the Knights Templar or modern Israel are legendary.

This is important because Communism and DEI are more or less the same thing repackaged for seculars and atheists. Kind of like how Christianity was intended to be a "Judaism for gentiles" sort of stuff.

It makes it far too easy to attack Christianity when you can just point to the failings of Islam and say "see this is why Abrahamic religions can't work".

What doesn't work is completely integrating Abrahamic Religion with politics and common sense.

If you don't want Communism or LGBT to completely erode into politics, common sense and reality, you DO NOT want Christianity or Islam to do the exact same because nothing good has ever came from it.
 
To simplify this for you, Western Paganism is 98% larp and 2% charismatic cult leader trying to get pussy. It has no real standing in the actual world, they're laughing stocks because they have no roots or tradition or history to stand on for the stage of legitimacy that actual religions have such as christianity to buddhism to whatever other wacky shit in the mainstream. Most of their history is literally just scribbled down by christian monks who thought the written accounts were interesting enough to save via transcribing the older crumbling documents to a newer set of documents over time(mostly the greek myths and bardic history and the poetic edda for the norse pantheon also done by a christian).
Their atheists of varying stripes most of the time relating to an anti-jew purity spiral complex when it comes to Christianity, some of them having an anti-christian complex because of a discordant childhood and relation to their parents and solely take to paganism because satanism became too mainstream to spite daddy, the rest being literally niggas who got too infatuated with dungeons and dragons european inspired polytheistic pantheons and started renaissance fair styled cults after them, a final trickle being a leftover of the religious LSD hippies from the 60s who associate Christianity again with superficial institutions and think tripping balls infront of a shittily carved god of the sky will finally make them NOT look like what they actually are which is just drug addicted bums.
 
Their beliefs might be heavily divergent, but ultimately they are all diverged from the same Jewish roots history-wise

Which is irrelevant to the point I was making. How are they similar? Saying they are cut from the same cloth means nothing if they often contradict each other or, in Islam's case, are not even remotely connected lineage-wise.

This naturally means that these religions are seedbeds for the worst sort of violence imaginable, things like the Taliban, the Knights Templar or modern Israel are legendary.

That is attempting to connect entirely mutually exclusive concepts. If it were the case that these religions are seedbeds of violence, why then do none-Christian societies also have histories of excessive violence? Why do you have to go back hundreds of years to the crusades to find an example of "Christian violence", but ignore secular societies such as Soviet Russia or Maoist China who have done the same things on a grander scale? It seems like you fall into the same trap that OP does, which is putting the cart before the horse in regards to where your moral quandries lie.

What doesn't work is completely integrating Abrahamic Religion with politics and common sense.

This has nothing to do with what I said, You just quoted me and went on a completely different tangent. You commit the same genetic fallacy that OP does and don't even have the gall the try and give an answer other than to double down on that fallacy.
 
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