Leaving Neverland - heehee

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What does one do... When confronted with all this clear child touching? As much as I like most of his fucking music, it's a real shame MJ wasn't taken down earlier in his career for this BS. Diddling anyone, especially kids, is absolutely the worst thing you can do to anyone and needs to be punished as such. Just because he made some damn good music in his career does not excuse this terrible find - and that's the fucking truth.

The world's gonna have to burn quite a bit for this one - anyone who condones this needs to be dragged out into the light while the iron is hot here. It's too late to do this to MJ, because - you know by now; that doesn't mean we can't start somewhere to right this wrong, honestly.
 
I get really tired of going back and forth on all these weird little things, when the facts as MJ admitted them are concerning. Here are the major things everyone agrees on:

  1. he slept in beds with A LOT of boys of prepubescent boys
  2. he settled lawsuits for millions of dollars for molestation claims from some of those boys
  3. and after paying out the millions of dollars, he didn't stop sleeping in beds with prepubescent boys.

#3 is especially damning. If it was so hurtful to be called a pedo and he was so innocent why the fuck would he keep doing the exact thing that got him accused and in trouble? If it was just innocent sleeping then why would he find it worthwhile to continue? If it were completely innocent why did he keep doing this shit after he had his own kids to sleep next to? His own explanations do not even get near explaining away the problems with the set of facts he admits to. The simple explanation is that he molested some kids. What specific kids got molested and if they were in the leaving neverland documentary isn't really relevant, I'm talking about what can be concluded based only on the facts that MJ volunteered to the world.


that isn't how it works lol, Josh isn't a moral authority. He is an authority on the rules of his own forum and who gets to stay or go. Razorfist is a lolcow with a thread and josh RTs stuff about lolcows. It may go as far as that, or not, I don't really care because I can make up my own mind.

I'm surprised you haven't shared your motivations for defending MJ (from the "things that personally piss you off" thread):

you have a heavy emotional investment in MJ being innocent. It might be helpful for other people to know this before they decide to argue with you or not.

It’s odd the way small details are picked apart by these defenders as if small errors make the huge, irrefutable, mountain of facts false too. Mike’s own statements and behavior -all the known, uncontested facts about all the various boys in his bed at Neverland, in hotels and on vacations, etc.. - make his pedophilia obvious.

There aren’t just Wade and James, there were several boys who accused MJ of abuse publicly but there were also other settlements that didn’t get much press or were kept totally secret. Like MJ paying his housekeeper $2 million settlement for molesting her son.

MJ had so many little boys by his side and in his bed for twenty years. There is no innocent explanation for it. None. Adult men don’t constantly share their beds with little boys, behind a bedroom with three locks, in a huge home with ample bedrooms for numerous guests. It’s not “odd behavior” it’s SOP pedo behavior, it’s the behavior of someone that has sex with little boys. There was no reason, other than sexual abuse, for Jackson to have regularly have boys in his bed all night, take vacations with them and stay alone in hotel rooms together like a couple.

Mikes “love for children” was limited to 50% of them, the ones with small penises he liked to play with. No girls ever shared Mike’s bed of pure innocent love.

Mike was a compulsive child rapist. Even when it threatened to ruin his career he couldnt stop because his entire sex drive was focused on small boys. Mike never had one legitimate adult romantic relationship in his entire life because he only had eyes for small boys.
 
It’s odd the way small details are picked apart by these defenders as if small errors make the huge, irrefutable, mountain of facts false too. Mike’s own statements and behavior -all the known, uncontested facts about all the various boys in his bed at Neverland, in hotels and on vacations, etc.. - make his pedophilia obvious.

There aren’t just Wade and James, there were several boys who accused MJ of abuse publicly but there were also other settlements that didn’t get much press or were kept totally secret. Like MJ paying his housekeeper $2 million settlement for molesting her son.

MJ had so many little boys by his side and in his bed for twenty years. There is no innocent explanation for it. None. Adult men don’t constantly share their beds with little boys, behind a bedroom with three locks, in a huge home with ample bedrooms for numerous guests. It’s not “odd behavior” it’s SOP pedo behavior, it’s the behavior of someone that has sex with little boys. There was no reason, other than sexual abuse, for Jackson to have regularly have boys in his bed all night, take vacations with them and stay alone in hotel rooms together like a couple.

Mikes “love for children” was limited to 50% of them, the ones with small penises he liked to play with. No girls ever shared Mike’s bed of pure innocent love.

Mike was a compulsive child rapist. Even when it threatened to ruin his career he couldnt stop because his entire sex drive was focused on small boys. Mike never had one legitimate adult romantic relationship in his entire life because he only had eyes for small boys.

I think it was pointed out earlier in the thread but all of MJ's alleged victims were young boys of a very specific age range all of whom had blond hair and blue eyes. That's not something you do if you just want to be friends, physical and gender preferences are something you do with potential sexual partners.
 
I saw the docu last night and my opinion is basically unchanged. The testimonies are pretty damning but there's not a lot of actual physical evidence beyond the trinkets he gave the boys. But I refuse to go after someone who hasn't been proven guilty in a court of law. So I'm leaning towards he was a pedo just more strongly now.
 
I think it was pointed out earlier in the thread but all of MJ's alleged victims were young boys of a very specific age range all of whom had blond hair and blue eyes. That's not something you do if you just want to be friends, physical and gender preferences are something you do with potential sexual partners.

Wade Robson, Gavin Arvizo, Jordan Chandler, and Jason Francia (the son of his housekeeper) all have brown eyes and dark hair. None of them really look similar apart from that either. Robson is white, Arvizo and Francia seem to be Hispanic, and Jordy Chandler looks black or bi-racial.
 
But I refuse to go after someone who hasn't been proven guilty in a court of law
I genuinely do not understand that. So you were fine with cosby.... until the 2nd trial? you're okay with R Kelly right now, but not in a few months from now (probably)? You're okay with anyone who died before they were caught being pedos? Is OJ innocent? What if there is something incredibly damning like video evidence found after death? The courts are the best system we have for determining who should go to jail, but it is not a substitute for using your own judgment.
 
Again, I don't really have a say in whether he did it or not, and I don't think we'll ever really know for sure (unless some legitimate damning proof comes out that serves for either case). And I agree that MJ is very shady. However, the actual evidence, let alone the incriminating stuff that would've locked him up, for him being a child molester is... questionable, to put it mildly. And I don't really adhere to the mindset of "well, I mean, it just SEEMS that way". Sorry. I just don't. But I agree that there's plenty of strong reasons to assume either side.

If you want to view Michael Jackson as a pedophile, you will. It’s very easy to do. He admitted to allowing children to sleep in his bedroom (which itself is the same size as a small two story house), and has been accused of child molestation more than once. He’s not the guy next door, was undeniably eccentric, and most certainly didn’t live a conventional life. I wouldn't be surprised if he was a child predator.

On the flip-side, to anyone who has bothered to look into the allegations against him - and I mean really look into them - there is more than enough evidence to demonstrate that he possibly a victim of extortion and copycat false claims for the past twenty six years (which includes the Los Angeles Police Department stating that Jackson should be presumed to be innocent, a jury finding him not guilty on every single charge against him, the Los Angeles Department of Children and Family Services twice investigating and clearing him of wrongdoing, the FBI conducting a very thorough investigation in which no evidence of wrongdoing was found, and the very apparent cash grab lawsuits of his posthumous accusers being tossed out of court; but I suppose the court was probably "just paid off", huh?)

I suppose my final world to everyone is to be reasonable, don't be rude, and quit being autistic (seems like those who defend him get way too emotional, and those who oppose seemingly want him to be a child molester more than anything so they can raise their pitchforks.) Try not to pull a Kavanaugh and automatically assume guilt based on testimony and hearsay alone. You'll be sticking your foot in your mouth if you do (I should know). Evidence and facts: I prefer these things.
 
I saw the docu last night and my opinion is basically unchanged. The testimonies are pretty damning but there's not a lot of actual physical evidence beyond the trinkets he gave the boys. But I refuse to go after someone who hasn't been proven guilty in a court of law. So I'm leaning towards he was a pedo just more strongly now.

But What type of evidence to you expect from an adult molesting little boys behind closed doors twenty years ago? Videos of him fingering their butts? The kids were suppose to preserve semen samples?

The is no disputing the kids spent tons of time alone with MJ, they slept MJs in bed at Neverland and in hotels alone with him, he gave them lots of gifts, took them on trips, he talked them on the phone regularly and sent lots of messages telling them how much he adored them. Many, many people witnessed MJ taking these boys behind closed, locked doors for extended periods or all night. None of this is normal behavior for a grown man, but it’s extremely common behavior how pedos behave.

So given that, these boys who spent countless hours locked away in MJ bedroom with him say what any person would already assume from such behavior - he was molesting them. I don’t know how anyone could believe that Mike was just watching cartoons all night in his locked bedroom alone, with dozens of different boys, aged 7-12 for two decades.

Given how quick most of KF is to call anyone with mildly creepy tendcies a pedo it’s amazing that when you have a person exhibiting and bragging about textbook pedo behaviors (I love sleeping with ten year old boys! It’s the highest expression of love!) some people suddenly here want DNA sperm samples from little boys’ underwear before they will believe Jackson could possible be doing something creepy with all his boy toys alone, all night, behind three deadbolt locked bedroom door.
 
Edit - meant to just edit this into my previous post but fucked it up b/c I’m on mobile device.

Again, I don't really have a say in whether he did it or not, and I don't think we'll ever really know for sure (unless some legitimate damning proof comes out that serves for either case). And I agree that MJ is very shady. However, the actual evidence, let alone the incriminating stuff that would've locked him up, for him being a child molester is... questionable, to put it mildly. And I don't really adhere to the mindset of "well, I mean, it just SEEMS that way". Sorry. I just don't. But I agree that there's plenty of strong reasons to assume either side.

If you want to view Michael Jackson as a pedophile, you will. It’s very easy to do. He admitted to allowing children to sleep in his bedroom (which itself is the same size as a small two story house), and has been accused of child molestation more than once. He’s not the guy next door, was undeniably eccentric, and most certainly didn’t live a conventional life. I wouldn't be surprised if he was a child predator.

On the flip-side, to anyone who has bothered to look into the allegations against him - and I mean really look into them - there is more than enough evidence to demonstrate that he possibly a victim of extortion and copycat false claims for the past twenty six years (which includes the Los Angeles Police Department stating that Jackson should be presumed to be innocent, a jury finding him not guilty on every single charge against him, the Los Angeles Department of Children and Family Services twice investigating and clearing him of wrongdoing, the FBI conducting a very thorough investigation in which no evidence of wrongdoing was found, and the very apparent cash grab lawsuits of his posthumous accusers being tossed out of court; but I suppose the court was probably "just paid off", huh?)

I suppose my final world to everyone is to be reasonable, don't be rude, and quit being autistic (seems like people want him to be a child molester more than anything.) Try not to pull a Kavanaugh and automatically assume guilt based on testimony and hearsay alone. You'll be sticking your foot in your mouth if you do (I should know). Evidence and facts: I prefer these things.

Comparing this to Kavanaugh is ridiculous. If Kavanaugh was witnessed by dozens of people taking numerous intoxicated or black out drunk girls behind locked doors for hours, or all night, on most weekends during his college years and then when asked about it later said sleeping next to a passed out drunk girl was the highest expression of pure love in media interviews? Then it would be an apt comparison.
 
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Try not to pull a Kavanaugh and automatically assume guilt based on testimony and hearsay alone. You'll be sticking your foot in your mouth if you do (I should know). Evidence and facts: I prefer these things.
This is a very important takeaway from all this. Accusations like this are serious matter and it's important to have factual evidence about it. It's easy for people to point the finger and say someone is guilty of an atrocity that they may have not committed.

I apologise for getting emotional, but at the end of the day I just want legitimate proof.
 
I registered an account here pretty much for the sole purpose of commentating on this issue.

Kudos to @MirnaMinkoff and @sperginity for dropping some much needed truth up in here, but there are still some important points which are missed. The biggest point that needs to be said: Michael Joseph Jackson was the gayest closeted celebrity who ever lived.

Gayer than Richard Simmons. Gayer than Justin Timberlake. Gayer than Marcus Bachmann's dick in Lindsey Graham's ass. Gayer than all of the homos Taylor Swift has "dated" combined. Gayer than Gaylor Swift's tongue in Camila Cabello's vagina.

I still don't think people appreciate how gay showbusiness is. Sure, there've been comings out, even amongst the least believable pretend heteros known to the Anglosphere (Kristen Stewart, Ricky Martin, Clay Aiken, Kevin Spacey – even though that was a shameless PR move that thankfully failed). Sure, the old pretense at conservative morality's been flushed for a frankly embarrassing level of wokeness (and it was a pretense, but image matters). But the celebrosphere's always has, and always will be, about trying to trick the masses into thinking the stars are just like them.

That's never been the case. Nor could it ever be the case. Sexual minorities, for numerous reasons, have always been more drawn to showbusiness than the heterosexual population which will always make up society's majority; and the mechanisms to prop up the now century-long lie that most of these people are straight are foundational and intractable. Even the rare open gays of the industry, such as Ryan Murphy and David Geffen, have actively shielded the sexualities of their boytoys (Darren Criss and Tom Cruise) in public. Even Taylor Swift, the most obviously closeted Millennial celebrity of all time, has still not been relegated to a public joke after multiple tours spent with a harem so obvious, they've been openly christened "The Squad" by tabloids who can't wait for her to come out as "bisexual" at age 45 after she gets divorced from Shawn Mendes.

Michael Jackson, like Taylor Swift, was just the most obvious case of his own generation. The three women in his life closest to him romantically (Brooke Shields, Lisa Marie, and Arnie Klein's Nurse) have all been on record saying he never had sex with them (Lisa Marie retracted, but said retraction has no credibility). LaToya admitted she saw dozens of boys spend the night with Michael when he was at their parents in the same interview where she admitted Papa Joe molested, at minimum, her and her sister (LaToya retracted, but said retraction has less credibility than Lisa Marie's). Jacko looked awkward as fuck every time he tried to pretend he was interested in a woman, especially for the "In the Closet" video with Naomi Campbell. Jacko named a love song, ostensibly about fucking a woman, "In the Closet" in 1992; five years after Liberace's death, and seven years after Rock Hudson's.

Unlike Gaylor, Michael Jackson was also a homosexual pedophile. There's a helluva lot more evidence he was up to something shady than there is even about Dan Schneider, who's also a pedophile, albeit a heterosexual one who generally seemed to be interested in targets a few years older than Jacko's preference.

Showbusiness is pretty similar to The Vatican: only a tiny minority's interested in the legitimate criminal predation, but the vast majority are lying about their interests, and the extent of the lying's so pervasive nothing short of shaking the very Earth'll make a difference. Like The Vatican, there's still hope: Frédéric Martel's In the Closet of the Vatican was a titanic move against the Church's closeted elite, and might just be the very thing Pope Francis needs to join the West with the East in allowing the ordination of married men, which was opened up on anyway by the procedure for converted Anglicans instituted by that notorious, dope-smoking, tie-dye wearing hippie Pius XII.

But, like The Vatican, this'll only happen if the public not only demands it, but insists on refusing to believe comforting lies in the face of overwhelming evidence.

Michael Jackson spent the overwhelming majority of his free time with boys between the ages of eight and sixteen, and stopped hanging out with almost all of 'em once they got older. He didn't treat them like his sons, nor even normal friends: he showed them porn, gave them booze and drugs and cigs, and took them to the most fun places on the planet. That's exactly how every human being alive treats those they're trying to seduce, and he did this to dozens of known boys. Child stars with real families, such as Elijah Wood and Daniel Radcliffe, were refused to be allowed to hang out with Jacko; and they're in a helluva lot better shape than Sean Lennon and Macaulay Culkin.

Not all of 'em have spoken up; many, including but not limited to Webster, 3T, and Donny Junior and Eric Trump, will likely remain silent for the rest of their lives; but every sexual abuse case involves people who won't speak up, and not one as big and obvious as Jacko's encounters this much public resistance. J-Law never admitted that spooge on her face belonged to Harvey, Ariana Grande never admitted Pete Davidson was only the second-ugliest guy she slept with, and there are dozens of black Chi-Town girls who'll spend the rest of their lives breaking down in tears when their kids ask if they can eat at McDonald's. Jacko'll always be a more sympathetic predator than those three: he endured horrific abuse at the hands of his father, and I wouldn't be surprise if Papa Joe either abused him sexually or pimped him to a producer; but Jacko deserves exactly as much benefit of the doubt as Weinstein, Schneider, and R. Kelly.

Pardon the autism. I was recently run over by a My Little Pony parade float.
 
I registered an account here pretty much for the sole purpose of commentating on this issue.

Kudos to @MirnaMinkoff and @sperginity for dropping some much needed truth up in here, but there are still some important points which are missed. The biggest point that needs to be said: Michael Joseph Jackson was the gayest closeted celebrity who ever lived.

Gayer than Richard Simmons. Gayer than Justin Timberlake. Gayer than Marcus Bachmann's dick in Lindsey Graham's ass. Gayer than all of the homos Taylor Swift has "dated" combined. Gayer than Gaylor Swift's tongue in Camila Cabello's vagina.

I still don't think people appreciate how gay showbusiness is. Sure, there've been comings out, even amongst the least believable pretend heteros known to the Anglosphere (Kristen Stewart, Ricky Martin, Clay Aiken, Kevin Spacey – even though that was a shameless PR move that thankfully failed). Sure, the old pretense at conservative morality's been flushed for a frankly embarrassing level of wokeness (and it was a pretense, but image matters). But the celebrosphere's always has, and always will be, about trying to trick the masses into thinking the stars are just like them.

That's never been the case. Nor could it ever be the case. Sexual minorities, for numerous reasons, have always been more drawn to showbusiness than the heterosexual population which will always make up society's majority; and the mechanisms to prop up the now century-long lie that most of these people are straight are foundational and intractable. Even the rare open gays of the industry, such as Ryan Murphy and David Geffen, have actively shielded the sexualities of their boytoys (Darren Criss and Tom Cruise) in public. Even Taylor Swift, the most obviously closeted Millennial celebrity of all time, has still not been relegated to a public joke after multiple tours spent with a harem so obvious, they've been openly christened "The Squad" by tabloids who can't wait for her to come out as "bisexual" at age 45 after she gets divorced from Shawn Mendes.

Michael Jackson, like Taylor Swift, was just the most obvious case of his own generation. The three women in his life closest to him romantically (Brooke Shields, Lisa Marie, and Arnie Klein's Nurse) have all been on record saying he never had sex with them (Lisa Marie retracted, but said retraction has no credibility). LaToya admitted she saw dozens of boys spend the night with Michael when he was at their parents in the same interview where she admitted Papa Joe molested, at minimum, her and her sister (LaToya retracted, but said retraction has less credibility than Lisa Marie's). Jacko looked awkward as fuck every time he tried to pretend he was interested in a woman, especially for the "In the Closet" video with Naomi Campbell. Jacko named a love song, ostensibly about fucking a woman, "In the Closet" in 1992; five years after Liberace's death, and seven years after Rock Hudson's.

Unlike Gaylor, Michael Jackson was also a homosexual pedophile. There's a helluva lot more evidence he was up to something shady than there is even about Dan Schneider, who's also a pedophile, albeit a heterosexual one who generally seemed to be interested in targets a few years older than Jacko's preference.

Showbusiness is pretty similar to The Vatican: only a tiny minority's interested in the legitimate criminal predation, but the vast majority are lying about their interests, and the extent of the lying's so pervasive nothing short of shaking the very Earth'll make a difference. Like The Vatican, there's still hope: Frédéric Martel's In the Closet of the Vatican was a titanic move against the Church's closeted elite, and might just be the very thing Pope Francis needs to join the West with the East in allowing the ordination of married men, which was opened up on anyway by the procedure for converted Anglicans instituted by that notorious, dope-smoking, tie-dye wearing hippie Pius XII.

But, like The Vatican, this'll only happen if the public not only demands it, but insists on refusing to believe comforting lies in the face of overwhelming evidence.

Michael Jackson spent the overwhelming majority of his free time with boys between the ages of eight and sixteen, and stopped hanging out with almost all of 'em once they got older. He didn't treat them like his sons, nor even normal friends: he showed them porn, gave them booze and drugs and cigs, and took them to the most fun places on the planet. That's exactly how every human being alive treats those they're trying to seduce, and he did this to dozens of known boys. Child stars with real families, such as Elijah Wood and Daniel Radcliffe, were refused to be allowed to hang out with Jacko; and they're in a helluva lot better shape than Sean Lennon and Macaulay Culkin.

Not all of 'em have spoken up; many, including but not limited to Webster, 3T, and Donny Junior and Eric Trump, will likely remain silent for the rest of their lives; but every sexual abuse case involves people who won't speak up, and not one as big and obvious as Jacko's encounters this much public resistance. J-Law never admitted that spooge on her face belonged to Harvey, Ariana Grande never admitted Pete Davidson was only the second-ugliest guy she slept with, and there are dozens of black Chi-Town girls who'll spend the rest of their lives breaking down in tears when their kids ask if they can eat at McDonald's. Jacko'll always be a more sympathetic predator than those three: he endured horrific abuse at the hands of his father, and I wouldn't be surprise if Papa Joe either abused him sexually or pimped him to a producer; but Jacko deserves exactly as much benefit of the doubt as Weinstein, Schneider, and R. Kelly.

Pardon the autism. I was recently run over by a My Little Pony parade float.
What did you drink before you wrote this and where can I get a crate of it?
 
I saw the docu last night and my opinion is basically unchanged. The testimonies are pretty damning but there's not a lot of actual physical evidence beyond the trinkets he gave the boys. But I refuse to go after someone who hasn't been proven guilty in a court of law. So I'm leaning towards he was a pedo just more strongly now.

Pictured, not proven guilty in a court of law:

692012

Pictured, found innocent:

692013

Pictured, also not found guilty in a court of law:

692015

Pictured, hearsay:

692019

What does one do... When confronted with all this clear child touching? As much as I like most of his fucking music, it's a real shame MJ wasn't taken down earlier in his career for this BS. Diddling anyone, especially kids, is absolutely the worst thing you can do to anyone and needs to be punished as such. Just because he made some damn good music in his career does not excuse this terrible find - and that's the fucking truth.

The world's gonna have to burn quite a bit for this one - anyone who condones this needs to be dragged out into the light while the iron is hot here. It's too late to do this to MJ, because - you know by now; that doesn't mean we can't start somewhere to right this wrong, honestly.

Ultimately, it's up to you, but I have a good comparison.

Chris Benoit was the most beloved professional wrestler of his time: he was thoughtful, talented, passionate, professional, athletic, a physical marvel, and he murdered his wife and son after turning his brain to senilic puddy.

I'm sure Vince McMahon, if he could've gotten away with it, would've covered up the affair. But that wasn't a possibility. However, since the affair couldn't be covered up, it has enabled everyone who knew Chris to actually speak honestly about the affair, and actual measures have been taken to at least meaningfully reduce the chances that such a horror won't be repeated.

Nothing comparable has been done by the Jackson camp. Really, the exact opposite has been done by the Jackson camp.

I'm fine admitting that Jackson was a brilliant singer, dancer, composer, and entertainer. He was the rare superstar with the talent to back up the hype; but he was a homosexual pedophile, and the likes of Sony and Jacko's Estate are actively defaming survivors of his abuse to keep themselves enriched with hundreds of millions of dollars. If you wish to make yourself a part of that, it's ultimately your choice; but I won't, and you won't ever have the luxury of pretending you didn't know about the kind of people you're directly benefiting now.

'Til Sony and the Estate admit who they've been covering for and actually offer reparations to the dozens of living, credible victims, they can collectively get fucked in a freshly-opened wound with Charlie Sheen's dick.

Wade Robson, Gavin Arvizo, Jordan Chandler, and Jason Francia (the son of his housekeeper) all have brown eyes and dark hair. None of them really look similar apart from that either. Robson is white, Arvizo and Francia seem to be Hispanic, and Jordy Chandler looks black or bi-racial.
Scott Thornton was an adult, and his professed seven-year relationship with Jacko is more credible than any relationship he had with a woman.

We all have types, but most humans are more than happy to be flexible, and venture outside it. Jacko was no exception.

Now explain the dozens of "special friendships" with boys between the ages of eight and sixteen the King of Pop devoted most of his free time towards.

This is a very important takeaway from all this. Accusations like this are serious matter and it's important to have factual evidence about it. It's easy for people to point the finger and say someone is guilty of an atrocity that they may have not committed.

I apologise for getting emotional, but at the end of the day I just want legitimate proof.
Like what? DNA evidence? Has Eric Trump been saving his underwear since the Reagan years?

Most actual criminal convictions don't involve as much evidence as has been put forth against Michael Joseph Jackson: he spent the supra-majority of his free time hanging out with boys between the ages of eight and sixteen, and treated them like his girlfriends:


At least two of the boys he was closest with (Webster and Culkin) refuse to discuss MJ in interviews.

His sister said he was gay, and that she saw him invite dozens of boys to their house when they lived with their parents. She retracted. Either the retraction or the original story is a lie, but the original story is substantially more credible.

He was raised a Jehovah's Witness, the most conservative and reactionary of America's Four Great Christian Cults. His upbringing provided no ethical basis for non-heterosexual-marriage based relationships; nor, judging by every Jackson-Family related revelation, would there've been any other kind of ethical basis provided to his life beyond "get rich and famous at any cost".

There were a few – emphasis on few – girls he got close to, and they're just as messed up as the boys he got close to:


Five men have publicly accused him of sexual abuse while they were boys. His other "special friends" who've either made no comment or said the opposite are almost all basket cases, as if they endured particularly nasty abuse as children (Culkin, Feldman, Lennon, Aaron Carter, Omar Bhatti).

There have been people justifiably executed on less evidence.
 
They seem to obsess with the fact that he's black, and the whole world is so racist that it wants to destroy his "legacy". It's funny for various reasons, first: he doesn't have a legacy, he was a fucking entertainer, for Christ's sake, he didn't find the cure for cancer. And second: he's the biggest racist I've ever seen in my life, he hated his black skin so much that he bleached it until he became a mummy.

I don't have hard feelings, I still enjoy some of his music and the fantastic OST for Sonic 3. But he fucked children's ass.

Something that nobody has said on this thread yet: why only boys? He had never brought girls to his tours, they only chose blonde boys as his companions. Nobody chooses friendships based on sex and physical characteristics, you do it for sexual partners.
And there’s a hundred pages of people with MJ themed avatars and names saying he dindu nuffin because of some combination of “he was never committed” or “they defended him before.” 150 pages in someone has the gall to say the media only cares because the victims are white men, but they were little boys. They legitimately don’t care about victims and just want to protect the man who did a silly dance with Eddie Murphy
 
I'll withhold judgement unless/until more accusers come forward. Because Michael's grooming game, as described in the movie, is on point, the way he subtly insinuates himself into the parents' trust, disarms them with his woe-is-me-I'm-so-lonely-and-never-had-a-childhood thing as an explanation for his behavior, and then progressively isolates them from their kids emotionally and physically (moving their hotel suites a little bit further at each tour stop until the parents are on a different floor entirely), and the way that he cycled through new 'it boys' until he got bored of them and moved on to fresher meat. If all of that is true, then there have to be dozens of James Safechucks and Wade Robsons out there, and there's no way they'll all stay quiet forever.
But God knows people are gonna do what they did back then and say "Well maybe they're lying and just want notoriety"

From what I've seen so far, Safechuck seems genuine to me. That audio he had of him and Michael is creepy by itself.
To be fair, sexual abuse victims can be unemotional even when discussing trauma. Sometimes even casual about it. They don't all cry at the subject and can be monotone.
I blame media for perpetuating the stereotype everyone who's been molested or raped as having to be a miserable weepy sad-sack all the time.
And there’s a hundred pages of people with MJ themed avatars and names saying he dindu nuffin because of some combination of “he was never committed” or “they defended him before.” 150 pages in someone has the gall to say the media only cares because the victims are white men, but they were little boys. They legitimately don’t care about victims and just want to protect the man who did a silly dance with Eddie Murphy
People did the very same for that Glee faggot who had hundreds of CP pics on his computer. "I liked them so obviously you're just a liar" but these are the people who would screech at parents who disown their kid over daring to say their uncle touched them. Oh the hypocrisy.
 
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I registered an account here pretty much for the sole purpose of commentating on this issue.

Kudos to @MirnaMinkoff and @sperginity for dropping some much needed truth up in here, but there are still some important points which are missed. The biggest point that needs to be said: Michael Joseph Jackson was the gayest closeted celebrity who ever lived.

Gayer than Richard Simmons. Gayer than Justin Timberlake. Gayer than Marcus Bachmann's dick in Lindsey Graham's ass. Gayer than all of the homos Taylor Swift has "dated" combined. Gayer than Gaylor Swift's tongue in Camila Cabello's vagina.

I still don't think people appreciate how gay showbusiness is. Sure, there've been comings out, even amongst the least believable pretend heteros known to the Anglosphere (Kristen Stewart, Ricky Martin, Clay Aiken, Kevin Spacey – even though that was a shameless PR move that thankfully failed). Sure, the old pretense at conservative morality's been flushed for a frankly embarrassing level of wokeness (and it was a pretense, but image matters). But the celebrosphere's always has, and always will be, about trying to trick the masses into thinking the stars are just like them.

That's never been the case. Nor could it ever be the case. Sexual minorities, for numerous reasons, have always been more drawn to showbusiness than the heterosexual population which will always make up society's majority; and the mechanisms to prop up the now century-long lie that most of these people are straight are foundational and intractable. Even the rare open gays of the industry, such as Ryan Murphy and David Geffen, have actively shielded the sexualities of their boytoys (Darren Criss and Tom Cruise) in public. Even Taylor Swift, the most obviously closeted Millennial celebrity of all time, has still not been relegated to a public joke after multiple tours spent with a harem so obvious, they've been openly christened "The Squad" by tabloids who can't wait for her to come out as "bisexual" at age 45 after she gets divorced from Shawn Mendes.

Michael Jackson, like Taylor Swift, was just the most obvious case of his own generation. The three women in his life closest to him romantically (Brooke Shields, Lisa Marie, and Arnie Klein's Nurse) have all been on record saying he never had sex with them (Lisa Marie retracted, but said retraction has no credibility). LaToya admitted she saw dozens of boys spend the night with Michael when he was at their parents in the same interview where she admitted Papa Joe molested, at minimum, her and her sister (LaToya retracted, but said retraction has less credibility than Lisa Marie's). Jacko looked awkward as fuck every time he tried to pretend he was interested in a woman, especially for the "In the Closet" video with Naomi Campbell. Jacko named a love song, ostensibly about fucking a woman, "In the Closet" in 1992; five years after Liberace's death, and seven years after Rock Hudson's.

Unlike Gaylor, Michael Jackson was also a homosexual pedophile. There's a helluva lot more evidence he was up to something shady than there is even about Dan Schneider, who's also a pedophile, albeit a heterosexual one who generally seemed to be interested in targets a few years older than Jacko's preference.

Showbusiness is pretty similar to The Vatican: only a tiny minority's interested in the legitimate criminal predation, but the vast majority are lying about their interests, and the extent of the lying's so pervasive nothing short of shaking the very Earth'll make a difference. Like The Vatican, there's still hope: Frédéric Martel's In the Closet of the Vatican was a titanic move against the Church's closeted elite, and might just be the very thing Pope Francis needs to join the West with the East in allowing the ordination of married men, which was opened up on anyway by the procedure for converted Anglicans instituted by that notorious, dope-smoking, tie-dye wearing hippie Pius XII.

But, like The Vatican, this'll only happen if the public not only demands it, but insists on refusing to believe comforting lies in the face of overwhelming evidence.

Michael Jackson spent the overwhelming majority of his free time with boys between the ages of eight and sixteen, and stopped hanging out with almost all of 'em once they got older. He didn't treat them like his sons, nor even normal friends: he showed them porn, gave them booze and drugs and cigs, and took them to the most fun places on the planet. That's exactly how every human being alive treats those they're trying to seduce, and he did this to dozens of known boys. Child stars with real families, such as Elijah Wood and Daniel Radcliffe, were refused to be allowed to hang out with Jacko; and they're in a helluva lot better shape than Sean Lennon and Macaulay Culkin.

Not all of 'em have spoken up; many, including but not limited to Webster, 3T, and Donny Junior and Eric Trump, will likely remain silent for the rest of their lives; but every sexual abuse case involves people who won't speak up, and not one as big and obvious as Jacko's encounters this much public resistance. J-Law never admitted that spooge on her face belonged to Harvey, Ariana Grande never admitted Pete Davidson was only the second-ugliest guy she slept with, and there are dozens of black Chi-Town girls who'll spend the rest of their lives breaking down in tears when their kids ask if they can eat at McDonald's. Jacko'll always be a more sympathetic predator than those three: he endured horrific abuse at the hands of his father, and I wouldn't be surprise if Papa Joe either abused him sexually or pimped him to a producer; but Jacko deserves exactly as much benefit of the doubt as Weinstein, Schneider, and R. Kelly.

Pardon the autism. I was recently run over by a My Little Pony parade float.
You posted this "truth" and yet nothing in this 3,000 page rant is anything more than conjecture.
 

It's pretty hilarious you think those videos are evidence of anything other than how fucking gay Jackson was. Elton John and RuPaul are way more masculine and seem more interested in pussy than Jackson.

(I don't even like referring to Jackson as gay because he didn't even like men, just boys, but I gay pedo fits.)

https://youtube.com/watch?v=RUvS9rTdzesDan Reed went back to the UK and now Piers Morgan is questioning if the guys are in it for money. I think after Reed appeared on this show, the made some cuts to the documentary.

Thought on this?

Documentary filmmakers aren't non-profit enterprises. Making money on a documentary doesn't have anything to do with its truthfulness. The Thin Blue line made money, it also freed an innocent man from death row.

The Jackson estate is a big money making enterprise too, so they are certainly in it for the money too.

You think, or have proof there were any cuts made? It's an odd rumor in this thread that "cuts where made" yet no one has shown any proof of it.
 
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