Final Fantasy XIV - Kiwi Free Company

[Agarathium1066]

To your original tangent, fuck male Viera. I don't hate for the reasons most people, I just liked them not existing as it made the culture more interesting in a game who's racial culture is already sort of eh. Regardless of the furry degenerates that Hrothgar attract, and all the eye bleach I need 90% of the time I queue up with them, I do like them because they at least look different from most the races.

My only beef with male viera remains that they're all uwu soft bois or some fucktard wearing all black with a scythe. Hrothgar aren't common enough in my experience to be an issue but when ya see one Hrothgar there's solid odds their furry boyfriend is in the party of alliance. They're going to /dote each other every time a boss dies because they really hope you're aware they're turbo faggots. Something that was instantly obvious when you saw their subligar and harness wearing ass waddle forward.

 

[Vapewizard]

I know objectively it's shitty of the devs that they clearly don't want to put effort into new hrothgar hairstyles cause there's less hroth players but the asshole in me thinks it's kinda based that Square said "Fuck furries."

 

[Smug Chuckler]

Ver archivo adjunto 3133088
Least we can show off our ebin glam in pvp easier, I suppose

oboi, can't wait for more close-up boob/butt pics like the good ole days from wow's armory

 

[John Titor]

Garlemald be like: We were brutally pushed back into the cold, desolate, hellish landscape you see before you by your ancestors, because you said we don't belong in your society over something we can't change. So we made our own and we decided to push back against our original oppressors after your various kinds fucked us over for multiple generations. Our history shows the fundamental unquestionable truth that war is a constant and unavoidable reality, and we will not simply let ourselves be the oppressed forever. Thus we became a brutal and efficient war machine.

Illiterates of Light be like: BUT UR FACIST AND RACIST!!!!!! WAAAAAAAAAARMONGERS!!!!!!!!!!

Some random Chad Ala Mhigan: Look, I know what you guys went through when you took over my country, I know what it means to lose your home, please have this to warm yourselves up and I'm sorry this happened to you.

I wonder if it would take the Alliance to do something horrible to hammer home the point that we shouldn't view this simply as a black and white "good vs evil" story kind of like in real life.

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

I wonder if it would take the Alliance to do something horrible to hammer home the point that we shouldn't view this simply as a black and white "good vs evil" story kind of like in real life.

They'll just blame capitalism or something something Hien instead of taking in whatever lesson you'd want to teach them about things not being black and white. These types of people barely understand, if they even do, real life as they generally have this incredibly warped perception of how things are based on what their own bubble tells them.

These people somehow ignore the lesson of how people's inability to come to an understanding creates chaos to innocent bystanders or hundreds if not thousands of years of war and strife throughout the entirety of FFXIV, while not being willing to understand the perspective of fictional people and just boiling them down to fashnazimongers. In a parallel world these type of people would have been just like the Ishgard church if you just changed around their place of origin and what teachings these chose to follow, dragons are now fashnazimongers and we must destroy them. That's what makes the illiteracy so funny.

 

[Local Degenerate]

You're a furry though, you deserve to suffer

Yeah, but, I'm already a furry, isn't that suffering enough, Yoshi-P?

I wonder if it would take the Alliance to do something horrible to hammer home the point that we shouldn't view this simply as a black and white "good vs evil" story kind of like in real life.

They kind of already tried. All three of the main factions have dug some *serious* skeletons out of their closet. From the Sultanate being complicit in the Syndicate being your traditional ruthlessly capitalistic potatoes, up to and including literally unpersoning the majority of the world, Kan-E-Senna being a totally worthless leader, allowing her people to die in medical beds because 'the elements said so, lul', and Merlwyb personally stabbing both the Sahagin and the Kobold square in the back, stealing all their land, and murdering them if they so much as piped up.

Had the Telophoroi not posed such a significant threat to the world, there's no doubt that at LEAST Merlwyb would've kept turning a blind eye to that. Nanamo, IIRC, straight stepped down, and allowed the Syndicate to go unopposed (It's been awhile since that happened, and I am sincerely retarded, so I'm probably wrong.), and Kan-E-Senna CONTINUES to be a cucked bitch in her own city to these nebulous 'elements'.

If none of these made these illiterates so much as scratch their heads and think, nothing will.

 

[Gravemind]

Nanamo, IIRC, straight stepped down, and allowed the Syndicate to go unopposed (It's been awhile since that happened, and I am sincerely retarded, so I'm probably wrong.)

She TRIED to step down, but Lolorito basically had to tell her "No, what you're GONNA do is stop being a stupid brat and learn how to actually be a proper fucking Sultana because the nation depends upon you as a figurehead for stability, and we on the Syndicate don't want to go dramatically shaking up the balance of power like that."

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

She TRIED to step down, but Lolorito basically had to tell her "No, what you're GONNA do is stop being a stupid brat and learn how to actually be a proper fucking Sultana because the nation depends upon you as a figurehead for stability, and we on the Syndicate don't want to go dramatically shaking up the balance of power like that."

I thought the implication was more something like:

Lolorito: "Look, we got far too many problems going on without completely unending the entire government into a literal revolution that changes our entire society. Please wait until we are in more peaceful times before we start talking about a class divide breaking revolution?"

Namano: "Okay you make a good point."

*end argument*

Considering the events in SB and beyond, I doubt anything would really change anyway as Namano has changed a good amount since Heavensward and she did learn that the Syndicte aren't all fucking Telediji-tier moustache twirling assholes they're just normal business assholes.

Edit: @Local Degenerate the elementals aren't "nebulous" at all, they're weakened, but they are very real and have murdered people (and specifically the people who would become the first Gridanias) in the past. We've even seen them in a small handful of side quests do something. The elementals are very much real, now if you think revolting against them is a valid idea is an entirely different topic (one worth exploring imo), but they are real and dangerous. The EW role quest for tanks showed that these little tree spirit fuckers still got some juice.

 

[Gravemind]

I thought the implication was more something like:

Lolorito: "Look, we got far too many problems going on without completely unending the entire government into a literal revolution that changes our entire society. Please wait until we are in more peaceful times before we start talking about a class divide breaking revolution?"

Namano: "Okay you make a good point."

*end argument*

Considering the events in SB and beyond, I doubt anything would really change anyway as Namano has changed a good amount since Heavensward and she did learn that the Syndicte aren't all fucking Telediji-tier moustache twirling assholes they're just normal business assholes.

Basically, but I do vaguely recall there being some mention about the Syndicate not wanting to overthrow the crown of Ul'dah in the first place since the people look to it for a sense of national unity just as much as the monetarists and the Syndicate keep Ul'dah's economy healthy. Hence why Lolorito has been, in a way, bending over backwards to pay restitution to Nanamo for all the bullshit Teledji pulled, which the Syndicate allowed.

But then again, Nanamo also cuts him some slack finally during that collaborative effort to gather relics for the Ragnarok when she tells him to pitch in too, but that he's also allowed to make a profit while doing so. I thought it was a good character development moment.

 

[Shqueefa]

My only beef with male viera remains that they're all uwu soft bois or some fucktard wearing all black with a scythe. Hrothgar aren't common enough in my experience to be an issue but when ya see one Hrothgar there's solid odds their furry boyfriend is in the party of alliance. They're going to /dote each other every time a boss dies because they really hope you're aware they're turbo faggots. Something that was instantly obvious when you saw their subligar and harness wearing ass waddle forward.

A friend of mine plays Hrothgar and talks about all the shit he deals with by playing that race in itself. Other Hrothgar will randomly /dote and /pet anywhere in the game, will send tells that start innocent then ask if they use mods and they get passive-aggressive when he tells them he doesn't use mods and to leave him alone. Majority of their glamour you already talked about but there is the occasional Hrothgar I'll spot that has a cool look, like wearing the Bojza armor with the new Garlean hat from the Lv83 dungeon or armor set of different pieces that work together. Hrothgar were supposed to get new hairstyles in Shadowbringers but never did so it was pretty clear at this point any hairstyles they do for Viera and Hrothgar were going to be half-assed and reused assets. Not sure why most Hrothgar care since they mod hats on their character along with huge cock and balls.

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

Basically, but I do vaguely recall there being some mention about the Syndicate not wanting to overthrow the crown of Ul'dah in the first place since the people look to it for a sense of national unity just as much as the monetarists and the Syndicate keep Ul'dah's economy healthy. Hence why Lolorito has been, in a way, bending over backwards to pay restitution to Nanamo for all the bullshit Teledji pulled, which the Syndicate allowed.

But then again, Nanamo also cuts him some slack finally during that collaborative effort to gather relics for the Ragnarok when she tells him to pitch in too, but that he's also allowed to make a profit while doing so. I thought it was a good character development moment.

I'd like to see a really honest talk between Namano and Lolorito, or the syndicate in general, about Ul'dah's class divide. Not Namano going "but muh poor people are suffering", I mean really honestly ask if the people at the bottom are there for an actual reason or if the government/upper class holds them down there? We here can obviously speculate using real world examples and such, but as they say "art imitates life", and I'd like to see FFXIV attempt to (even if it'll be anime as fuck) answer that question or at least talk about it. At least the seething would be potentially funny if they try to justify why poor people are poor, by basically going something akin to "The poor people act like niggers, so why should they be rewarded?". Inb4Ul'dahAMonetaristsABProtests in 6.X

It feels really strange to just not talk about it after we had a similar class revolution in Ishgard, and while Godbert made a very good part regarding how overly sympathetic Namano is, I don't think that necessarily answers the plights of the commoner and if they are truly far too below the upper crust to ever really go anywhere. I don't necessarily want some commie revolution or what have you, I just want to see what these people have to say and if actual progress can be made that doesn't involve revolt or dramatic restructuring of the government.

 

[Local Degenerate]

A friend of mine plays Hrothgar and talks about all the shit he deals with by playing that race in itself. Other Hrothgar will randomly /dote and /pet anywhere in the game, will send tells that start innocent then ask if they use mods and they get passive-aggressive when he tells them he doesn't use mods and to leave him alone. Majority of their glamour you already talked about but there is the occasional Hrothgar I'll spot that has a cool look, like wearing the Bojza armor with the new Garlean hat from the Lv83 dungeon or armor set of different pieces that work together. Hrothgar were supposed to get new hairstyles in Shadowbringers but never did so it was pretty clear at this point any hairstyles they do for Viera and Hrothgar were going to be half-assed and reused assets. Not sure why most Hrothgar care since they mod hats on their character along with huge cock and balls.

Is that in EU? I've never gotten that in any NA server.

As for mods, while I do mod my hat back in (a red mage without a hat is no red mage at all), it does lose a lot of the fun when you know no one else can see it.

 

[Well Intentioned]

by basically going something akin to "The poor people act like niggers, so why should they be rewarded?". Inb4Ul'dahAMonetaristsABProtests in 6.X

Doesn't that more or less happen when they talk about what to do with the Ala Mhigans?

Sultana wants to git dem money for dem programz and it takes Lolorito and Godbert to basically tell her no, you can't just throw money at the problem and expect it to fix itself. Give people a sense of purpose, meaning, and a chance to lift everyone up (ie, make profits. Although in Godbert's case I do think he admits to taking a bit of a bath on the Gold Saucer.)

Native Ul'dah folks, in my mind, are generally better off. There are issues hinted at here and there, basically whenever the Ala Mhigans are brought up, but my understanding is that it is within the context of the fallout from the Calamity. Shit is fucked up and it's hard for the little guy, to some degree, because Eorzea just got skullfucked by Bahamut.

I've always gotten the sense that Ul'dah is the kind of place where anyone can kinda climb the ladder, so to speak. You're not living in fear over whether or not shooting that deer or lighting a campfire is going to enrage the Elements while your rulers fuck around with Moogles, and you're not living in fear that some asshole is gonna slit your throat because your dockside town is wink, wink, no we're not pirates, we're 'privateers' and have a 'code', wink wink.

(I know that's a super simplistic take on Limsa, but the game routinely reiterates that it is meant to be a dangerous place.)

You see it with a dude like Raubahn who more or less worked his way up to the position he got, as well as other characters. Momodi, I think, was another rags to riches character who ended up becoming a very reputable and respected person.

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

Doesn't that more or less happen when they talk about what to do with the Ala Mhigans?

Sultana wants to git dem money for dem programz and it takes Lolorito and Godbert to basically tell her no, you can't just throw money at the problem and expect it to fix itself. Give people a sense of purpose, meaning, and a chance to lift everyone up (ie, make profits. Although in Godbert's case I do think he admits to taking a bit of a bath on the Gold Saucer.)

Native Ul'dah folks, in my mind, are generally better off. There are issues hinted at here and there, basically whenever the Ala Mhigans are brought up, but my understanding is that it is within the context of the fallout from the Calamity. Shit is fucked up and it's hard for the little guy, to some degree, because Eorzea just got skullfucked by Bahamut.

I've always gotten the sense that Ul'dah is the kind of place where anyone can kinda climb the ladder, so to speak. You're not living in fear over whether or not shooting that deer or lighting a campfire is going to enrage the Elements while your rulers fuck around with Moogles, and you're not living in fear that some asshole is gonna slit your throat because your dockside town is wink, wink, no we're not pirates, we're 'privateers' and have a 'code', wink wink.

(I know that's a super simplistic take on Limsa, but the game routinely reiterates that it is meant to be a dangerous place.)

You see it with a dude like Raubahn who more or less worked his way up to the position he got, as well as other characters. Momodi, I think, was another rags to riches character who ended up becoming a very reputable and respected person.

Spoiler: Ul'dah sperging

I look at those things differently because one are a bunch of refugees who are going through a culture shock and are in sudden need of employment. Namano wants to use gibs, that doesn't fix it, so we make actual employment. My question is more asking what would the "lower class" struggles be like and why are they there? Up to this point it has mostly been showing Ala Mhigans, but I don't think I can buy the idea that natives of Ul'dah don't go through something all their own if they're not already in the upper crust. I doubt the miners are all well and good, or the less then well off merchants and peddlers struggling to get by, or the people far outside Ul'dah's actual borders like in those little hovels in the corners.

It seems bizarre that their would be no class divide inherent to Ul'dah society even if it isn't as radical as the Ala Mhigan refugee situation showed, with people stepping over each other to rise to the top, trying to suppress the poor for their own gain, usage of questionable business practices, or anything at all prior to the refugee crisis. The Brass Blades take bribes left and right from basically anyone or anything, people pay for sketchy mercenaries to do their bidding like with the Reaper group, human trafficking exists for some kind of reason (as-in their is a supply and demand for such an operation to be profitable enough to be worth breaking the law), and I doubt this all only just showed up because Ala Mhigans happened.

In a society like Ul'dah where you can literally buy your way into politics in the most blatant manor possible, as Raubahn did, their are always people from somewhere willing to suppress the poor for their own ends be it to ascend to power or to maintain it. If that is true, what can be done about that? Is this sort of system healthy, why or why not? I don't feel that section in SB really answers those questions, nor did the part in HW where Lolorito tries to talk Namano out of her political revolution.

Raubahn is an extreme exception, the man is a champion of the realm in his own right, he could be blessed by Hydaelyn and become the WoL if we weren't the main character easily especially before 2.55's events. Ala Mhigans are in literal ways, built different, due to their environment which is why Midlanders and Highlander look different and Raubahn was a skilled warrior far before his days in the colosseum. Raubahn also had some kind of backing from Namano from what I recall during his climb to the top, which is a stroke of good fortune and exemplifies his character to gain such favor, but without that I don't think he would have gotten this far or afford to do as much as he did, and I doubt most people could get such favor.

While I enjoy shitting on Ilberd and calling him a fucking asshole, that man really shows the type of road Raubahn could have led if he didn't get Namano's favor or if he was a worse warrior, as those two both fought with all they had for Ala Mhigo and Raubahn is the only one who made any sort of leeway while Ilberd was still struggling to get by. Momodi I frankly don't recall her story at all so I can't comment.

Let me rephrase it like this, now that the war is effectively over in EW, where do all the nations go from here? We don't have a united purpose anymore, we don't need to fear much of anything, we can focus on more relatively petty issues when we don't have to worry about war machines killing us. We sort of fix Limsa midway through ShB already, Gridania is just in the same spot it always is because nature spirits that murder you are a good way to keep people in line, have we truly fixed everything in Ul'dah? I personally don't think so, I think it has things worth going into more then most of the city states until Gridania wants to ask the Elemental question or Ala Mhigans try to murder each other...again.

tl;dr: We need our current expansion dosage of "Ul'dah is fucked up, here's why" subplot now that the wars are over and people go from uniting against a singular enemy to now being at each other's throats again and I think we can explore more to this nation from a different angle. Can also just put it in the role quest continuation for EW instead of the MSQ.

 

[John Titor]

I'll have to look up if Ul'dah was the way it is before the Garlean invasion.

Stray thought but say what you want about Mogstation but it is far from shameless compared to Chocobo GP, a mobile game they charge full price for. Christ.

 

[Local Degenerate]

I'll have to look up if Ul'dah was the way it is before the Garlean invasion.

Stray thought but say what you want about Mogstation but it is far from shameless compared to Chocobo GP, a mobile game they charge full price for. Christ.

I do have to be autistic here. It's not a full priced game. it's 40 USD.

Not an excuse for the way they're shoving that fucking battle pass in, but I'm sick of hearing the term 'full priced game' get thrown around.

 

[Zeke Von Genbu]

I'll have to look up if Ul'dah was the way it is before the Garlean invasion.

Although not wholly related to the discussions of Ul'dah's poltics...

Spoiler: Ul'dah spoilers behind Hildibrand 2.X stuff

Remember when Ul'dah made a zombie plague to remove its former neighbor and then hid that detail from history so well that actual Eorzean historian scholars like Eric from the Monk quest legitimately don't know about this and spread around a complete lie? How we needed fucking Hildibrand to discover the truth behind this terrible history? Ul'dah's history is fucking awful, probably second worst city state after Ishgard especially if we just look at Eorzea/Aldernard specifically. Ala Mhigan's may be violent sand people and have a tendency to cause some kind of fuss, but at least they didn't zombie plague their neighbors. They just killed an enemy general invited under a false peace talk.

I still laugh that Hildibrand of all side quests is used to reveal deep Ul'dah lore.

 

[John Titor]

Although not wholly related to the discussions of Ul'dah's poltics...

Spoiler: Ul'dah spoilers behind Hildibrand 2.X stuff

Remember when Ul'dah made a zombie plague to remove its former neighbor and then hid that detail from history so well that actual Eorzean historian scholars like Eric from the Monk quest legitimately don't know about this and spread around a complete lie? How we needed fucking Hildibrand to discover the truth behind this terrible history? Ul'dah's history is fucking awful, probably second worst city state after Ishgard especially if we just look at Eorzea/Aldernard specifically. Ala Mhigan's may be violent sand people and have a tendency to cause some kind of fuss, but at least they didn't zombie plague their neighbors. They just killed an enemy general invited under a false peace talk.

I still laugh that Hildibrand of all side quests is used to reveal deep Ul'dah lore.

Same questline had a throwaway line on how Uldah used to have good relations with the Amaljaa. They literally created their own problems.

 

[Übertroon]

Same questline had a throwaway line on how Uldah used to have good relations with the Amaljaa. They literally created their own problems.

To be fair the Ascians were always conspiring to create conflict between different races and nations to cause chaos and create a necessity for summoning primals, they were involved in prolonging the beast tribe conflicts

 

[Vapewizard]

Imagine ranting to strangers about your love life in the limsa aetheryte plaza.