Marvel Cinematic Universe

[StarkRavingMad]

Excepting Winter Soldier where I can already see it, what more was on the minds of Iron Man, Infinity War, and both Guardians movies? This isn't meant as a rebuttal or anything. I'd like to know what you see.

I'll go through this as quickly as I can without writing a novel, haha.

Iron Man, to me, is a redemption story that very much reflects the actor behind the role. The movie feels pretty sincere in that sense, to me.

The first Guardians movie is about trauma/pain and how you don't have to go through it all alone, as especially reflected in the climax of the movie with the Power Stone.

The second Guardians movie is about family (insert RLM Carrie Fisher meme here), as imperfect or messed up as they can be. To me, it's a very thematic movie that works because so much attention is placed on most of the characters (who are very, very flawed). All of the Gamora and Nebula moments work for me, the final moment with Rocket and Quill is one of my favorite MCU moments ever, and I loved everything involving Yondu. I think it's one of the most underrated and underappreciated MCU movies, personally. I think that James Gunn put a lot of thought and care into the themes of the movie, from the opening credits (where everyone acts as some family member/parent to Groot) to the final shot of the movie with Rocket crying upon the realization that he has a family who loves him despite his mistakes and regular unpleasantness.

I almost wrote a novel with praising Infinity War, but I'll just leave it at this: I think that the writing for Infinity War was, really, really great. I felt that there was a lot of care put into the writing (more care than Endgame, let's be honest, haha). To me, the writing was so good, that I actually had a smile on my face the entire time while watching the movie for the first time ... Even during the downer ending while everyone was dying. When writing is that good to me, I have a smile on my face that doesn't go away until the credits start rolling. I think Infinity War definitely took some notes from The Empire Strikes Back and tried to recreate something like it for a series of film, and I think it succeeded in becoming "The Next Empire."

 

[Oh Shit I'm Sorry]

I'm hyped for the first Jay Jonah Jameson movie since the aughts, personally. Spiderman does traditionally get more screentime than he deserves in those, but it's worth it.

Only if they bring J.K. Simmons back to play him.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Only if they bring J.K. Simmons back to play him.

Well J.K. Simmons did play Jameson in Far From Home.

 

[Stab You in the Back]

I think it's one of the most underrated and underappreciated MCU movies, personally.

GotG 2 is appreciated to the extent it deserves. Even if one were to appreciate its themes, the movie feels like a loud, obnoxious, 3 hour long video game cutscene. It is a grotesquely ugly and annoying film. There's nothing real to it. Nothing tactile.

 

[Jason Wynn]

I can enjoy (some of) the Marvel movies as good, dumb popcorn flicks. They're entertaining for a couple of hours, but they're not high art or some progressive project ushering in a complete paradigm shift. They're just summer blockbuster action flicks. That's what I think irritates me most. If you're not lying prostrate singing the praises of a piece of media, people chimp the fuck out. When did it become acceptable behavior for full grown adults to throw an autistic temper tantrum if Joe Rando doesn't have the exact same opinions on a piece of media you happen to like or dislike?

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

Only if they bring J.K. Simmons back to play him.

Mein Führer...J. K. Simmons...

...has already been tapped to play the role.

When did it become acceptable behavior for full grown adults to throw an autistic temper tantrum if Joe Rando doesn't have the exact same opinions on a piece of media you happen to like or dislike?

When "Nerd" culture became mainstream but normies only adopted the bad parts and not the good.

 

[StarkRavingMad]

Might be late on this, but has anyone seen the leaked footage of Black Widow's death? It's an alternate scene; an alternate scene that isn't on the Endgame Blu-Ray. It might be on Disney+ (I wouldn't know since I didn't get Disney+)?

Now, let me preface what I'm about to say with this: I am a fan of Avengers: Endgame. I think that most of the movie is great (specifically when concerning Cap and Iron Man's respective arcs). However, there are a lot of small things about Endgame that I would change. Had some things been different about Endgame, I think it could have easily reached the heights of Infinity War for me.

This alternate version of Black Widow's death is so good that I'm almost angry. I think this is SO much better than the version we got in the final movie. Black Widow's death has always felt a bit "off" to me, in the sense that I think it played out too similarly to Gamora's death in Infinity War (even down to the music they used). Even though the scenes are pretty similar, Gamora's death stands out FAR more than Nat's.

With this alternate take, Black Widow goes out more like a total badass (which gives me a much stronger sense of "girl power" than that on-the-nose moment the movie did in the finale, if you ask me). Plus, it makes Nat's arc in the film feel more complete and triumphant, as she literally gets to see herself give Thanos a big 'ol middle finger. Not only that, but this take incorporates Thanos into the plot much more, giving that sense of dread and frantic-ness that Infinity War had. I always felt that Thanos wasn't involved in Endgame nearly as much as he should have been, and this alternate scene really brings those thoughts home to me, sadly.

The "Time Heist" in of itself is delightful to watch. However, I always felt that the heist almost comes across as too easy for the Avengers. If 2014 Thanos had found out about their plans earlier on in the movie, then maybe they could have turned the Time Heist into a frantic chase away from Thanos? That would have added more drama and excitement to the film, in my opinion. And it would have made 2014 Thanos feel just as cunning as the 2018 Thanos the audience grew to know in Infinity War.

Again, I'll reiterate that I overall loved Endgame. The movie gets things more right than they do wrong. It just doesn't measure up to the greatness of Infinity War for me. Infinity War is a movie where I can't name a single thing I would change. If I think Infinity War is the modern day Empire Strikes Back, then I would say that Endgame is the modern day Return of the Jedi for me. They stuck the landing, but it's not quite as good as its predecessor.

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

Might be late on this, but has anyone seen the leaked footage of Black Widow's death? It's an alternate scene; an alternate scene that isn't on the Endgame Blu-Ray. It might be on Disney+ (I wouldn't know since I didn't get Disney+)?

https://youtube.com/watch?v=n7r24G2JLWU
Now, let me preface what I'm about to say with this: I am a fan of Avengers: Endgame. I think that most of the movie is great (specifically when concerning Cap and Iron Man's respective arcs). However, there are a lot of small things about Endgame that I would change. Had some things been different about Endgame, I think it could have easily reached the heights of Infinity War for me.

This alternate version of Black Widow's death is so good that I'm almost angry. I think this is SO much better than the version we got in the final movie. Black Widow's death has always felt a bit "off" to me, in the sense that I think it played out too similarly to Gamora's death in Infinity War (even down to the music they used). Even though the scenes are pretty similar, Gamora's death stands out FAR more than Nat's.

With this alternate take, Black Widow goes out more like a total badass (which gives me a much stronger sense of "girl power" than that on-the-nose moment the movie did in the finale, if you ask me). Plus, it makes Nat's arc in the film feel more complete and triumphant, as she literally gets to see herself give Thanos a big 'ol middle finger. Not only that, but this take incorporates Thanos into the plot much more, giving that sense of dread and frantic-ness that Infinity War had. I always felt that Thanos wasn't involved in Endgame nearly as much as he should have been, and this alternate scene really brings those thoughts home to me, sadly.

The "Time Heist" in of itself is delightful to watch. However, I always felt that the heist almost comes across as too easy for the Avengers. If 2014 Thanos had found out about their plans earlier on in the movie, then maybe they could have turned the Time Heist into a frantic chase away from Thanos? That would have added more drama and excitement to the film, in my opinion. And it would have made 2014 Thanos feel just as cunning as the 2018 Thanos the audience grew to know in Infinity War.

Again, I'll reiterate that I overall loved Endgame. The movie gets things more right than they do wrong. It just doesn't measure up to the greatness of Infinity War for me. Infinity War is a movie where I can't name a single thing I would change. If I think Infinity War is the modern day Empire Strikes Back, then I would say that Endgame is the modern day Return of the Jedi for me. They stuck the landing, but it's not quite as good as its predecessor.

Strongly disagree here. Unless I'm missing something she doesn't really even get sacrificed. She just dies. That kind of invalidates the whole point.

And honestly I still don't get the love for either of those movies. They have great set pieces and were thoroughly entertaining but there were a good number of outright dumb ideas at work weighing it down. It was no Empire. I don't think either of them were even among the best of the MCU movies. They're like the top of the average tier ones.

 

[Manwithn0n0men]

And honestly I still don't get the love for either of those movies. They have great set pieces and were thoroughly entertaining but there were a good number of outright dumb ideas at work weighing it down. It was no Empire. I don't think either of them were even among the best of the MCU movies. They're like the top of the average tier ones.

Infinity war was very good [but not great] , Edgame was kind of a jenky mess

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

Infinity war was very good [but not great] , Edgame was kind of a jenky mess

Time travel for a setting that is not built entirely around it almost always goes badly.

 

[Manwithn0n0men]

Time travel for a setting that is not built entirely around it almost always goes badly.

All the character arcs are also kinda Jenky. The end for Iron Man was satisfying, the end for Cap was a mess

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

All the character arcs are also kinda Jenky. The end for Iron Man was satisfying, the end for Cap was a mess

Cap never got enough screentime outside his own movies. Makes it hard to make the arc solid.

 

[Manwithn0n0men]

Cap never got enough screentime outside his own movies. Makes it hard to make the arc solid.

Thor IMO came out of nowhere when you contextualize the character. Its part of the Lazy PTSD meme. Hawkeye made totes sense. Natasha's ending was also kinda dumb. Hulks was lame.

 

[Scarlett Johansson]

IW >>>>> Endgame

It was a cool scene but the one we got had more emotional impact in my opinion.

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

Hulk and Banner merging needed to be on screen. Thor turning into a NEET sorta makes sense in a way....but seems to undo all his growth from the previous films.

However none of this matters to me that much because my favorite character in the entire MCU is that weird cyborg grub thing that hangs out with the rock guy. I'm not joking. Really. I love that little guy (girl?). Stand alone movie when?

 

[Manwithn0n0men]

Hulk and Banner merging needed to be on screen. Thor turning into a NEET sorta makes sense in a way....but seems to undo all his growth from the previous films.

However none of this matters to me that much because my favorite character in the entire MCU is that weird cyborg grub thing that hangs out with the rock guy. I'm not joking. Really. I love that little guy (girl?). Stand alone movie when?

But we could have Hulk and Banner merging because of the Infinity Stones

 

[Oh Shit I'm Sorry]

Well J.K. Simmons did play Jameson in Far From Home.

That's good to hear. He's right up there with RDJ in terms of perfect casting choices.

 

[That Chris Guy]

And honestly I still don't get the love for either of those movies. They have great set pieces and were thoroughly entertaining but there were a good number of outright dumb ideas at work weighing it down. It was no Empire. I don't think either of them were even among the best of the MCU movies. They're like the top of the average tier ones.

Well yeah, to me IW was no Empire either. Its biggest problem is that unlike Empire nothing's permanent. Luke lost his hand - it's gone forever, and Vader will always be his father. If the most important thing to take away were that Han got frozen in carbonite then yeah, I could see the comparison with Empire, but it isn't.

Spoiler: Containment Box

Even when I saw IW on the big screen, the death of 50% of the population didn't matter since you knew they were all coming back next film, and you were only kidding yourself if you thought otherwise. Had the future remained uncertain and there had genuinely been a risk this would be a different story. Empire had that - you didn't know what the hell Luke would do about Vader, where Han would be going or anything about The Emperor. IW's only question was how they'd be brought back, but there was no legitimate fear that they wouldn't return, because it's Disney/Marvel and death means nothing.

IW itself was a better movie than most of the MCU films, let down by a couple of pathetic attempts at comedy and the lack of despair over such a catastrophic act of genocide. I personally don't like what they did with Thanos's character because he doesn't command fear. Vader did, but Thanos is just that misguided chucklefuck who you'd like to spend time in a bar with - a running problem with Marvel's weak villainy.

Overall though, the movie was alright and I'd more readily rewatch it over about 90% of their library.

Hulk and Banner merging needed to be on screen.

The problem with Reconciled Professor Hulk is that he felt too much like Beast. He felt like a straight rip of Hank's character dynamic since Hulk's personality was missing.

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

Yeah most Marvel villains being weak (and the good ones being dead or all but written out like Red Skull) has been a consistant problem. As has the complete lack of threat from their adversaries. It first started grating on me in Age of Ultron where Ultron and his drones drop like flies without getting any good hits in. I assume they were going for the old "it doesn't matter how many we kill because they are endless" thing. Which can work and be quite scary. But it only works if you have a lot of wear and tear on the heroes. Make it clear they're just barely hanging on. Daredevil did it, but nothing else Marvel has.

The other mooks and supervillains have even less going for them than Ultron.

 

[samuraicrack]