KR North Korea Threatens to Strike Guam - Korean War 2 Electric Boogalo heating up

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/08/nor...trike-on-guam-reports-citing-state-media.html

Trump: North Korea best not make any more threats 4 Hours Ago | 05:03

North Korea said on Wednesday it is "carefully examining" a plan to strike the U.S. Pacific territory of Guam with missiles, just hours after U.S. President Donald Trump told the North that any threat to the United States would be met with "fire and fury".

A spokesman for the Korean People's Army, in a statement carried by the North's state-run KCNA news agency, said the strike plan will be "put into practice in a multi-current and consecutive way any moment" once leader Kim Jong Un makes a decision.

In another statement citing a different military spokesman, North Korea also said it could carry out a pre-emptive operation if the United States showed signs of provocation.

Earlier Pyongyang said it was ready to give Washington a "severe lesson" with its strategic nuclear force in response to any U.S. military action.

Washington has warned it is ready to use force if need be to stop North Korea's ballistic missile and nuclear programs but that it prefers global diplomatic action, including sanctions.

The consequences of any U.S. strike would potentially be catastrophic not only for North Koreans but also South Korea, Japan and the thousands of U.S. military personnel within range of any North Korean retaliatory strikes.

"North Korea best not make any more threats to the United States. They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen," Trump told reporters at the Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster, New Jersey.

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Guam is far removed from the U.S. mainland. Credit: Google Maps.

The U.N. Security Council unanimously imposed new sanctions on North Korea on Saturday over its continued missile tests, that could slash the reclusive country's $3 billion annual export revenue by a third.

North Korea has made no secret of plans to develop a nuclear-tipped missile able to strike the United States and has ignored international calls to halt its nuclear and missile programs.

It says its intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs) are a legitimate means of defense against perceived U.S. hostility. It has long accused the United States and South Korea of escalating tensions by conducting military drills.

U.S. stocks closed slightly lower after Trumps comment, while a widely followed measure of stock market anxiety ended at its highest in nearly a month. The U.S. dollar index pared gains and the safe-haven yen strengthened against the U.S. currency.

Tensions rise
The United States has remained technically at war with North Korea since the 1950-53 Korean conflict ended in an armistice rather than a peace treaty. The past six decades have been punctuated by periodic rises in antagonism and rhetoric that have always stopped short of a resumption of active hostilities.

Tensions have risen since North Korea carried out two nuclear bomb tests last year and two ICBM tests last month.

The Trump administration's attempts to pressure North Korea into abandoning its nuclear and missile ambitions have so far gained little traction.

U.S. Defense Secretary Jim Mattis has warned of an "effective and overwhelming" response against North Korea if it chose to use nuclear weapons but has said any military solution would be "tragic on an unbelievable scale."

The United States has 28,500 troops in South Korea to guard against the North Korean threat. Japan hosts around 54,000 U.S. military personnel, the U.S. Department of Defense says, and tens of thousands of Americans work in both countries.

Seoul is home to a population of roughly 10 million, within range of massed pre-targeted North Korean rockets and artillery, which would be impossible to destroy in a first U.S. strike.

The Washington Post reported on Tuesday that North Korea has successfully produced a miniaturized nuclear warhead that can fit inside its missiles, according to a confidential U.S. intelligence assessment.

But U.S. intelligence officials told Reuters that while North Korea has accelerated its efforts to design an ICBM, a miniaturized nuclear warhead, and a nosecone robust enough to survive reentry through the Earths atmosphere from space, there is no reliable evidence that it has mastered all three, much less tested and combined them into a weapon capable of hitting targets in the United States.

The bottom line is that its almost impossible, given the amount and reliability of available intelligence, to reach a high-confidence assessment of the Norths nuclear capabilities, a U.S. intelligence official said.

U.S. intelligence officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity, also said there is no certainty about the number of nuclear warheads North Korea has assembled, with estimates ranging from 20 to as many as 60 and most experts leaning toward the lower end of that range.

North Korea's ICBM tests last month suggested it was making technical progress, Japan's annual Defence White Paper warned.

"It is conceivable that North Korea's nuclear weapons programme has already considerably advanced and it is possible that North Korea has already achieved the miniaturisation of nuclear weapons and has acquired nuclear warheads," it said.

War of words
On Monday, U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson held the door open for dialogue, saying Washington was willing to talk to Pyongyang if it halted its missile test launches.

Still, he maintained the pressure, urging Thailand on Tuesday for more action against Pyongyang.

Former U.S. diplomat Douglas Paal, now with the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace think tank in Washington, said Trump should not get into a war of words with Pyongyang.

It strikes me as an amateurish reflection of a belief that we should give as we get rhetorically. That might be satisfying at one level, but it takes us down into the mud that we should let Pyongyang enjoy alone, said Paal, who served as a White House official under previous Republican administrations.

South Korea reiterated further United Nations resolutions against Pyongyang could follow if it did not pull back.

"North Korea should realize if it doesn't stop its ... provocations, it will face even stronger pressure and sanctions," Defense Ministry spokesman Moon Sang-gyun told a news briefing. "We warn North Korea not to test or misunderstand the will of the South Korea-U.S. alliance."

Lockheed Martin Corp, the Pentagon's No. 1 weapons supplier, said on Tuesday its customers are increasingly asking about missile defense systems.

"The level of dialogue ... is now at the prime minister and minister of defense level," Tim Cahill, the vice president of Lockheed's Air and Missile Defense business, told Reuters.


WATCH: North Korea makes a nuclear weapon that can fit in its missiles, US intelligence says
 
The last time the Norks did this was last year, and Obama basically rolled over and gave them food and fuel aid. Trump is (rightly) sick of seeing this happen every year since the collapse of the Soviet Union and isn't taking any shit from them. The Norks are pissed that the gravy train has ended and they're getting some fucking discipline now.
The food and aid shitshow happens towards the start of every year - and it's no gravy train for them, it's basically the difference between mass starvation in a bad harvest or a continuation of the status quo. The world throws them food because like throwing meat to a starving wolf, it keeps them from going on a rampage for now. This is also different from thier usual bluster and promises of destruction - this is very specific and not near the time of any holiday or internal celebration for North Korea.

TL;DR We don't want a repeat of the 90's famine in NK where they started to eat each other and a collapsing regime with nukes is risky to the whole world

EDIT: This is also one of the few times where someone with power is actually playing the escalation game, which is really dumb because nobody wins the escalation game.
 
The food and aid shitshow happens towards the start of every year - and it's no gravy train for them, it's basically the difference between mass starvation in a bad harvest or a continuation of the status quo. The world throws them food because like throwing meat to a starving wolf, it keeps them from going on a rampage for now. This is also different from thier usual bluster and promises of destruction - this is very specific and not near the time of any holiday or internal celebration for North Korea.

TL;DR We don't want a repeat of the 90's famine in NK where they started to eat each other and a collapsing regime with nukes is risky to the whole world

EDIT: This is also one of the few times where someone with power is actually playing the escalation game, which is really dumb because nobody wins the escalation game.

August is usually when the South and the US do military drills.

Eat the fucking hat dickhead.
 
August is usually when the South and the US do military drills.

Eat the fucking hat dickhead.
They protest those every year and threaten a preemptive strike on the south usually for those. This is really really specific, and more importantly, arguably within their capabilities to perform.
 
I'm no fan of Trump, but it seems like the entire left is currently loosing their shit over this and blaming Trump and acting like WWIII is definitely happening, despite North Korean saber rattling being a thing that's gone on for decades that has yet to lead to anything other than NK shitting itself and doing nothing. For once I think Trump's fault in something is minimal, because I'm pretty sure NK would be tarding out regardless of who the current US president is. It's what they do.

The only thing that is different now is that Trump told them in no uncertain terms that they should shut their whore mouths. Usually, the presidents and prime ministers choose their words more wisely and aim for talks to "solve the issue" (while ordering some international relief organisations to ship a bit more food towards Pyongyang, so they stop REEEing). Instead of a more traditional "dude, calm your tits, we can talk this out", Trump went "You talk like a fag and your shit's all retarded." and that is the sole issue at hand.
In order to save face, Fatty has to be a tiny bit more aggressive than usual, hence the plan to launch missiles towards Guam, but these plans aren't ready "yet".
Meanwhile, South Korea has told Pyongyang they will retaliate if shit hits the fan, but they are open for talks. To me, this seems like a gesture of good will towards the Norks and as a means for the Norks to save face without launching their missiles (which wouldn't be that bad, but a further step on the downward spiral of escalation).
It would be a somewhat convenient way to de-escalate the situation without looking like a fool that talks big and then is afraid to go through with it.

Though I can't really say whether Fatty would be willing to take advantage of this offer or not. Afaik, his role as the leader is not so comfortable as that of his father, so he might feel like he has to show off his strength.
Maybe he's going to launch his missiles towards Guam but have them fall into the ocean way before they get even close. That way, he can still claim he went through with his threat despite "missing" Guam by a couple hundred km.
 
The food and aid shitshow happens towards the start of every year - and it's no gravy train for them, it's basically the difference between mass starvation in a bad harvest or a continuation of the status quo. The world throws them food because like throwing meat to a starving wolf, it keeps them from going on a rampage for now. This is also different from thier usual bluster and promises of destruction - this is very specific and not near the time of any holiday or internal celebration for North Korea.

TL;DR We don't want a repeat of the 90's famine in NK where they started to eat each other and a collapsing regime with nukes is risky to the whole world

EDIT: This is also one of the few times where someone with power is actually playing the escalation game, which is really dumb because nobody wins the escalation game.
A starving North Korean would eat the hat in a heartbeat.
 
I wish the media would make up their mind whether Trump is a mad man who is gonna lead us into a nuclear war, or whether he's a clown that no one takes seriously and because of it we're gonna end up in a nuclear war
 
The only thing that is different now is that Trump told them in no uncertain terms that they should shut their whore mouths. Usually, the presidents and prime ministers choose their words more wisely and aim for talks to "solve the issue" (while ordering some international relief organisations to ship a bit more food towards Pyongyang, so they stop REEEing). Instead of a more traditional "dude, calm your tits, we can talk this out", Trump went "You talk like a fag and your shit's all exceptional." and that is the sole issue at hand.
In order to save face, Fatty has to be a tiny bit more aggressive than usual, hence the plan to launch missiles towards Guam, but these plans aren't ready "yet".
Meanwhile, South Korea has told Pyongyang they will retaliate if shit hits the fan, but they are open for talks. To me, this seems like a gesture of good will towards the Norks and as a means for the Norks to save face without launching their missiles (which wouldn't be that bad, but a further step on the downward spiral of escalation).
It would be a somewhat convenient way to de-escalate the situation without looking like a fool that talks big and then is afraid to go through with it.

Though I can't really say whether Fatty would be willing to take advantage of this offer or not. Afaik, his role as the leader is not so comfortable as that of his father, so he might feel like he has to show off his strength.
Maybe he's going to launch his missiles towards Guam but have them fall into the ocean way before they get even close. That way, he can still claim he went through with his threat despite "missing" Guam by a couple hundred km.
His rule is more solid now, but he's in a position where if he wants to keep the generals on his side, he has to keep proving he's a strong leader. Escalation is entirely the wrong thing to do with someone who cannot show weakness.
 
His rule is more solid now, but he's in a position where if he wants to keep the generals on his side, he has to keep proving he's a strong leader. Escalation is entirely the wrong thing to do with someone who cannot show weakness.

A sign of someone who is a strong leader and will not show weakness is someone who would

EAT
THE
HAT
 
His rule is more solid now, but he's in a position where if he wants to keep the generals on his side, he has to keep proving he's a strong leader. Escalation is entirely the wrong thing to do with someone who cannot show weakness.
I agree, Trump has essentially put Kimmy Fat Un into a tight spot where he would have to make a move in order to show strength.
Which is why the SK offer to have talks is so interesting to me. Without that, escalation would be the only option, but this way, SK has given NK a sensible solution where everyone can later pretend they won.
US can claim to not have given in to NK bullshit.
SK can be smug about their moral high ground and level headed approach.
NK can claim to have scared their enemies into political talks on NKs terms cause they were just so afraid of rinkydink NK knockoff missiles.
 
I agree, Trump has essentially put Kimmy Fat Un into a tight spot where he would have to make a move in order to show strength.
Which is why the SK offer to have talks is so interesting to me. Without that, escalation would be the only option, but this way, SK has given NK a sensible solution where everyone can later pretend they won.
US can claim to not have given in to NK bullshit.
SK can be smug about their moral high ground and level headed approach.
NK can claim to have scared their enemies into political talks on NKs terms cause they were just so afraid of rinkydink NK knockoff missiles.
The problem is the Fatty himself. He's said time and again he won't listen to any discussion by any country. Much less a US-allied one like SK.

The fact they haven't even listened to their sorta-ally China either. It's like Kim wants the world to turn against him at this point. No matter how suicidal it is to him or his regime.
 
A preemptive strike of any facilities capable of doing this would be entirely legal and proportionate.

Frankly, I think we should do it.
 
The problem is the Fatty himself. He's said time and again he won't listen to any discussion by any country. Much less a US-allied one like SK.

The fact they haven't even listened to their sorta-ally China either. It's like Kim wants the world to turn against him at this point. No matter how suicidal it is to him or his regime.

He keeps this up and North Korea won't exist in the next decade.
 
He keeps this up and North Korea won't exist in the next decade.

If this dumb, fat son of a bitch touches one hair on the head of one person in any U.S. state, territory, possession, protectorate, fucking whatever, he goes down in flames. I may not approve of Trump saying it in the dumbass way he did, but he was simply stating a fact.


Trump is a moron, but now that the orcs are making specific, credible threats about actual targets, the escalation spiral is pretty much inevitable.
 
If this dumb, fat son of a bitch touches one hair on the head of one person in any U.S. state, territory, possession, protectorate, fucking whatever, he goes down in flames. I may not approve of Trump saying it in the dumbass way he did, but he was simply stating a fact.
Agreed. While Trump could have said it in a less idiotic way, the point of the matter is that Kim started it. And the US and its allies in SK, Japan and Australia will end it if China doesn't do it first.
 
I've heard that South Korea doesn't even want to unify with the North anymore since they saw how reunification damn near bankrupted Germany, and East Germany as fucked up as it was, wasn't as bass-akwards and fucked up as North Korea.
It would actually be easier, since North Koreans don't even expect to eat anymore. So just supplementing their diets a little bit and leaving the survivors be would be enough. East Germans expected civilization and shit. And their own industries got gutted, and instead of hiring poor East Germans, West Germany just imported muslims.

So South Korea would have an easier time of it and could take things slowly.
 
Agreed. While Trump could have said it in a less idiotic way, the point of the matter is that Kim started it. And the US and its allies in SK, Japan and Australia will end it if China doesn't do it first.

I would almost prefer China wipe out North Korea just so we don't have to deal with flak from Canada, our European allies and the UN.
 
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