Who would have been the best Middle Eastern overlord?

Who would have been the best Middle Eastern overlord?


  • Total de votantes
    23
Registrado
14 de Mayo, 2019
NASSER
Basically fascist
Arab pan-nationalism, BTFO Britain and France
Anti-Israeli

SAUDIS
Decadent and degenerate
Hypocritical Quran-thumpers
Among the last absolute monarchies
Western-aligned while promoting anti-Western jihadists

HUSSEIN
Fascist renegade
Persian genocide
Imperial aspirations of recreating Babylon

ISRAEL
Actually civilized
Have the US as puppets
Awful

CALIPHATE
SLAVE MARKET WAIFUS
BTFO Yazidi Satanists
Retarded

AYATOLLAH
Shiite theodemocracy
Anti-Israeli, anti-West, Russian-aligned
Persian, so not Arab

THE SHAH
Based Persian throwback
Brutal despot of a dysfunctional realm with pockets of modernity
Western-aligned
 
You're forgetting someone, habibi.
30ottoman-sultan-mehmed-the-conqueror-entering-constantinople-in-1453.-wikimedia.jpg
 
Out of these... Saddam I guess. Bashar, would probably be better.

Nasser was kind of fucking stupid, and he only "beat" the English and French because the US under Eisenhower stepped in. And to boil that issue down as much as possible: It was an election year and Eisenhower was campaigning on keeping the peace, and Anthony Eden of Britain decided to seize the Suez without even consulting the US as a big dick powermove. Eden assumed the US would be on board, he was dead wrong, and got bigger dicked by Eisenhower.

The Israelis having overlordship would exacerbate the terrorism/insurgency/caliphate problems even more than it already is.

The KSA/Iran/ISIS all have the same problem of being rather unstable, and exporters of said instability. It would never last.

As for the Shah, As you said Persian. Persians are not going to be able to rule a unified State in the ME.
 
Alt-History Hashemite Arabia
hashemite arabia.jpg


The Sharifian or Sherifian Solution, (الحلول الشريفية) as first put forward by T. E. Lawrence in 1918, was a plan to install three of Sharif Hussein's four sons as heads of state in newly created countries across the Middle East: his second son Abdullah ruling Baghdad and Lower Mesopotamia, his third son Faisal in Syria, and his fourth son Zeid in Upper Mesopotamia. The Sharif himself would not wield any political power in these places, and his first son, Ali would be his successor in Hejaz.

Antonius' The Arab Awakening, 1938, later traced Arab nationalism to the reign of Muhammad Ali Pasha in Egypt. He argued that the Arab nation (which consists of racial and cultural-linguistic elements) was "dormant" for centuries, and that institutions established by Protestant missionaries and educators from the United States had a specific role in the renewal and "awakening" of Arabic as a national language. He saw the role of the American University of Beirut (originally the Syrian Protestant College) as central to this development, although he noted that by the end of the 19th century that role had diminished because the college initiated instruction in English. According to Antonius, American missionaries, educators and institutions played a critical role in the development of American soft power during the Edwardian era and after World War I.

By the end of the 19th century, the torch of Arab nationalism had been passed to Arab intellectuals (residing in Greater Syria and in Europe) and to Arab officers in the Ottoman Army that formed a secret society to ultimately promote Arab nationalist interests. These officers proved particularly useful during World War I after the leadership of the movement openly shifted allegiance to support the Entente. Other than tracing the birth of the Arab national movement, Antonius also argues that it was Britain that dishonored its prior commitments to the Arabs, and instead pursued its own colonial interests at the expense of what Antonius calls the "true will of the people," namely unity and independence of the would-be Arab state. I believe the Balfour Declaration may have played an alternate role here instead.

Given the need to rein in expenditure and factors outside British control, including France's removing of Faisal from Syria in July 1920, and Abdullah's entry into Transjordan (which had been the southern part of Faisal's Syria) in November 1920, the eventual Sharifian solution was somewhat different, the informal name for a British policy put into effect by Secretary of State for the Colonies Winston Churchill following the 1921 Cairo conference. Faisal and Abdullah would rule Iraq and Transjordan respectively; Zeid did not have a role, and ultimately it proved impossible to make satisfactory arrangements with Hussein and the Kingdom of Hejaz.

The current dynasty was founded by Sharif Hussein ibn Ali, who was appointed as Sharif and Emir of Mecca by Sultan Abdul Hamid II in 1908, then in 1916 – after concluding a secret agreement with the British – was proclaimed King of Arab countries (but only recognized as King of the Hejaz) after initiating the Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Empire. His sons Abdullah and Faisal instead assumed the thrones of Jordan and Iraq in 1921, and his first son Ali succeeded him in the Hejaz in 1924. Abdullah was assassinated in 1951, but his descendants continue to rule Jordan today. The other two branches of the dynasty did not survive; Ali was ousted by Ibn Saud to form Saudi Arabia after the British withdrew their support from Hussein in 1924/25, and Faisal's grandson Faisal II was executed in the 1958 Iraqi coup d'état.

I consider the Sharifian Solution to have been the final and complete solution to the Arab Question. Perfidious Albion be damned.
 
Alt-History Hashemite Arabia
Ver archivo adjunto 3653380

The Sharifian or Sherifian Solution, (الحلول الشريفية) as first put forward by T. E. Lawrence in 1918, was a plan to install three of Sharif Hussein's four sons as heads of state in newly created countries across the Middle East: his second son Abdullah ruling Baghdad and Lower Mesopotamia, his third son Faisal in Syria, and his fourth son Zeid in Upper Mesopotamia. The Sharif himself would not wield any political power in these places, and his first son, Ali would be his successor in Hejaz.

Antonius' The Arab Awakening, 1938, later traced Arab nationalism to the reign of Muhammad Ali Pasha in Egypt. He argued that the Arab nation (which consists of racial and cultural-linguistic elements) was "dormant" for centuries, and that institutions established by Protestant missionaries and educators from the United States had a specific role in the renewal and "awakening" of Arabic as a national language. He saw the role of the American University of Beirut (originally the Syrian Protestant College) as central to this development, although he noted that by the end of the 19th century that role had diminished because the college initiated instruction in English. According to Antonius, American missionaries, educators and institutions played a critical role in the development of American soft power during the Edwardian era and after World War I.

By the end of the 19th century, the torch of Arab nationalism had been passed to Arab intellectuals (residing in Greater Syria and in Europe) and to Arab officers in the Ottoman Army that formed a secret society to ultimately promote Arab nationalist interests. These officers proved particularly useful during World War I after the leadership of the movement openly shifted allegiance to support the Entente. Other than tracing the birth of the Arab national movement, Antonius also argues that it was Britain that dishonored its prior commitments to the Arabs, and instead pursued its own colonial interests at the expense of what Antonius calls the "true will of the people," namely unity and independence of the would-be Arab state. I believe the Balfour Declaration may have played an alternate role here instead.

Given the need to rein in expenditure and factors outside British control, including France's removing of Faisal from Syria in July 1920, and Abdullah's entry into Transjordan (which had been the southern part of Faisal's Syria) in November 1920, the eventual Sharifian solution was somewhat different, the informal name for a British policy put into effect by Secretary of State for the Colonies Winston Churchill following the 1921 Cairo conference. Faisal and Abdullah would rule Iraq and Transjordan respectively; Zeid did not have a role, and ultimately it proved impossible to make satisfactory arrangements with Hussein and the Kingdom of Hejaz.

The current dynasty was founded by Sharif Hussein ibn Ali, who was appointed as Sharif and Emir of Mecca by Sultan Abdul Hamid II in 1908, then in 1916 – after concluding a secret agreement with the British – was proclaimed King of Arab countries (but only recognized as King of the Hejaz) after initiating the Arab Revolt against the Ottoman Empire. His sons Abdullah and Faisal instead assumed the thrones of Jordan and Iraq in 1921, and his first son Ali succeeded him in the Hejaz in 1924. Abdullah was assassinated in 1951, but his descendants continue to rule Jordan today. The other two branches of the dynasty did not survive; Ali was ousted by Ibn Saud to form Saudi Arabia after the British withdrew their support from Hussein in 1924/25, and Faisal's grandson Faisal II was executed in the 1958 Iraqi coup d'état.

I consider the Sharifian Solution to have been the final and complete solution to the Arab Question. Perfidious Albion be damned.
This looks very reasonable, with its inclusion of a Kurdistan and not having an Israel.
 
This looks very reasonable, with its inclusion of a Kurdistan and not having an Israel.
T. E. Lawrence thought so on the ground, but of course the higher-ups back in London thought they knew best. Separating the decision-making from the local level observations has always been a constant problem for advanced societies. Another glorious victory for Winston Churchill & world history, I suppose.
 
The mongols had the right idea. Just burn it all down and move everyone to Tennessee. It's not healthy to live next to all that sand. There's no winners
 
Biased towards Israel obviously, but a lot of its policies would have unfucked the west without destroying the infrastructure.
 
Me because I like tobacco, silk, and I think Jews and Muslims can be attractive. I’d be the best Sultan.
 
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