Undertale / Deltarune / Toby Fox Discussion

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Professor Donger dijo:
I've seen people pointing out that Toby probably wanted to make Kris a dude but made him "They/Them" because people liked Frisk so much.

A lot of fans accept the idea that Kris himself is a dude, especially if you look at how all his interactions are written, and is only called They because the player is taken into account for the pronouns and it acknowledges that Kris's actions aren't his own
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The biggest indicator that even the most shrill fans of the "they/them" shit secretly know Kris is a dude is how they NEVER draw him with tits. You'd think if he was really this genderless blob everyone kept insisting he was, there'd be a more even distribution like their was with Frisk and Chara, wouldn't there be?
 
Retarded Weeb dijo:
Apparently a few trannies are really mad about how Starwalker appears in the climbing mini-game if he's active because it denies Ralsei his important scene of "character development".
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He can't stop winning.
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Cave Fisher dijo:
The biggest indicator that even the most shrill fans of the "they/them" shit secretly know Kris is a dude is how they NEVER draw him with tits. You'd think if he was really this genderless blob everyone kept insisting he was, there'd be a more even distribution like their was with Frisk and Chara, wouldn't there be?
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It's also funny, Chara is almost always drawn as a female. Nobody throws a hissy fit about her being some they/them genderblob.

I think Frisk is the only one the genderblob thing works for. Because Frisk looks like this:
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I finally get it, the key to making a non-binary character is making them ugly as fuck.
 
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JVTim112 dijo:
The whole thing is a dream, and defeating the nightmares will wake the dreamer, killing everyone else on the island, but saving link and the dreamer.
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I do think at the end we probably will have to seal the school closet fountain and say goodbye to Ralsei.
Also at the end of Chapter 1 when Susie is asking whether everything was a dream or not one of the options you can pick is "I'm not a dream." or something like that.
That could also have been the part of the prophecy that Susie sperged out over as well. There's many options there.

Maybe if he's lucky Ralsei will get to become a real goat on some random farm I don't fucking know. :lit:
 
Slumbie dijo:
It's also funny, Chara is almost always drawn as a female. Nobody throws a hissy fit about her being some they/them genderblob.

I think Frisk is the only one the genderblob thing works for. Because Frisk looks like this:
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I finally get it, the key to making a non-binary character is making them ugly as fuck.
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Frisk is an actual child so you can make them androgynous. Kris is a TEENAGER where physical and behavioral differences start becoming more pronounced, you can't make them androgynous unless it's a very specific plot point
 
Bob Barbas dijo:
Also at the end of Chapter 1 when Susie is asking whether everything was a dream or not one of the options you can pick is "I'm not a dream." or something like that.
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Iirc that's in CH 3 and the options are;
"I'm real"
"Your friends are real"
"Sucks to be you"

If you pick "I'm real" Kris says it really monotone, which is the usual indication that the option isn't Kris's thoughts and it's all you.

Kris's actual thoughts should be obvious lmao.
 
Cave Fisher dijo:
The biggest indicator that even the most shrill fans of the "they/them" shit secretly know Kris is a dude is how they NEVER draw him with tits. You'd think if he was really this genderless blob everyone kept insisting he was, there'd be a more even distribution like their was with Frisk and Chara, wouldn't there be?
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Well there is one comic where Kris has top surgery scars but we don't talk about that
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I've been thinking about this Kris non-binary evidence. This is from Mancountry and the thingy says "non-men are a-ok too", and they swear by this little piece of dialouge. But if you think about it, it's really dumb. If the Rudins put it in here just for Kris to feel heckin' valid, why not just outright say "non-binary are a-ok too", and everybody clapped. But no it's just "non-men are a-ok too", which could mean girls too and is just as vague. Like, if Toby Fox such a heckin' enby ally and put an enby character into the game, he would just namedrop "non-binary" into the game for Christ's sake.

Also, I don't really get how "why it's gotta be queen and king" is proof of Kris being non-binary. Writing down one of the girls as king was a non-issue, so why does Suise suddenly bring it up if it's in this sense? (not to mention Susie says "we", not just Kris)

Also, not related, but the dialouge between Kris and Noelle if you put them as king and queen is way more endearing than anything that came out of Suselle.
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Cave Fisher dijo:
The biggest indicator that even the most shrill fans of the "they/them" shit secretly know Kris is a dude is how they NEVER draw him with tits. You'd think if he was really this genderless blob everyone kept insisting he was, there'd be a more even distribution like their was with Frisk and Chara, wouldn't there be?
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To be... fair(?), I don't think those types of fans really like to draw breasts anyway because it's too male gaze-y. Like you'd find it kind of difficult to find art of Susie or Noelle where they have visible breasts without it having a "this was obviously drawn by an artist that also draws porn" feel to it. I guess it's technically lore-accurate since it's not like female characters are generally drawn with visible breasts on their sprites, I think the female character with the most clear breast lines might be the Queen's giant robot.
 
I know this was meant to release with 3/4 and all, but this being "one last fun adventure" feels like a total misfire conceptually. Chapter 4 was already the turning point where "Fun adventures!" Were basically over, we have a real job to do now. For fuck's sake, the new battle theme was literally called "From now on".

I have seen the mystery box shit play out so many times at this point that I can almost guarantee Toby has fucked himself and not given himself enough time to satisfactorily wrap things up. It is either going to be gay meta handwavey bullshit or crammed into an hour in the last chapter.

The only way I can see the game holding up is that the weird route comes back in a meaty and meaningful way, with answers exclusive to it, and that sword route is a real thing that also makes a considerable difference on the plot.
 
Deus Exica dijo:
The only way I can see the game holding up is that the weird route comes back in a meaty and meaningful way, with answers exclusive to it, and that sword route is a real thing that also makes a considerable difference on the plot.
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I mean considering the WR will apparently have an entire version of CH 7 unique to it I don't see why it wouldn't.

SWORD already predicted the Weird Route up until now.
 
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