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This seems to be the direction things are heading now that the dust from chapter 5 has settled and people have gotten their theories together.
Some VERY INTERESTING things I noticed about chapter 5 weird route I haven't seen anyone mention yet:
Noelle feels like she's been "watching herself through the glass." Sound familiar? You looked through the glass.
For some strange reason, for just a brief moment...
It's as though her actual self is forced to watch an alternate version of her life play out. This backs up the fucked up timeline theory I've seen in this thread btw.
Someone else is moving Noelle through her life for her? If we take what she's saying here at face value, she either:
1. Is self-aware that she is code in a video game and has no free will (most likely).
2. Also has a SOUL (this is a stretch).
Obviously this monologue exists as a parallelism to Kris but it makes me wonder if she has a similar situation going on.
Kris has to do "Kris things" and Noelle has to do "Noelle things". The story of Deltarune is deterministic; there are no real choices, characters will only act within the bounds of their pre-determined code and only by exerting our external will on the game and by extension literally breaking it can we change that.
If you're of the opinion that chapter 4 weird route was a metaphor for rape then you may have noticed the lake scene also has sexual overtones. After reaching a certain depth in the lake
Kris can't stop and can only proceed, Noelle gets more excited throughout and there is even a climax at the end. Seriously, reread the dialogue through that lens and you will see what I mean. (although I could just be dirty minded).
on its own it's ranges from "Toby Fox is a hack Fraud" to "That was pretty good." It has its moments but everything around those moments are painful to sit through
arg told us that "cold water fells from top of the sky" is going to happen later. WE GONNA TIME TRAVEL INTO FUTURE?
"THE EARTH WAS COVERED IN WATER, DINOSAURS APPEARED, AN ICE AGE..."
"ARE THERE STILL DINOSAURS?"
I think that earth being covered in water is the roaring, dinosaurs appearing are the titans of the roaring, but ice can seemingly kill all of them. "It seems to be capable of regenerating if not fatally wounded" - CHECK act on a Titan when it defends
If you're of the opinion that chapter 4 weird route was a metaphor for rape then you may have noticed the lake scene also has sexual overtones. After reaching a certain depth in the lake
Kris can't stop and can only proceed, Noelle gets more excited throughout and there is even a climax at the end. Seriously, reread the dialogue through that lens and you will see what I mean. (although I could just be dirty minded).
It’s not just that. Telling Noelle to stop makes her drag Kris out anyway and say that he doesn’t actually want to stop, and if you do it enough times, then she will tell him to proceed.
It’s not just that. Telling Noelle to stop makes her drag Kris out anyway and say that he doesn’t actually want to stop, and if you do it enough times, then she will tell him to proceed.
To take a step away from all of the Noelle/Susie/Kris stuff for a moment; what's the consensus with Asgore? From what I've read, it looks like Toby decided to retcon the guy into "Toriel's crazy stalker ex" like the Sans fanbase wanted; am I missing something, or no? I admit that Dreemur's my favorite...
Unfortunately Asgore is more or less in the exact same position he was in before 5. He's so fucking vague that we can't know what his motives really are.
It appears that "something happened" on "that day" and it's somehow tied to Dess's disappearance and Asgore wanted to prove that it "wasn't his fault" and it was because of the Dark Worlds but he became so obsessed with it everyone thought he was crazy and Toriel left his ass. Same as before.
5 ends with him kinda sorta giving up his search for Kris's sake, which is nice, but then he's kidnapped by the Knight 2 minutes later anyway.
To take a step away from all of the Noelle/Susie/Kris stuff for a moment; what's the consensus with Asgore? From what I've read, it looks like Toby decided to retcon the guy into "Toriel's crazy stalker ex" like the Sans fanbase wanted; am I missing something, or no? I admit that Dreemur's my favorite...
He was being creepy, but it felt like he got a full character arc in chapter 5 despite not moving the story forward. He realized that he was a creep and his obsession pushed everyone away, so he was ready to let go. Then he got kidnapped, so nothing advanced.
To take a step away from all of the Noelle/Susie/Kris stuff for a moment; what's the consensus with Asgore? From what I've read, it looks like Toby decided to retcon the guy into "Toriel's crazy stalker ex" like the Sans fanbase wanted; am I missing something, or no? I admit that Dreemur's my favorite...
I feel your pain because Asgore is the best written character in Undertale. In Deltarune he is completely passive and all of his evidence gathering literally amounts to nothing. He's more of a plot device than an actual character. As soon as it seems like he's about to develop and move on from Toriel he gets kidnapped by The Knight lol. Don't expect to see much more of him until the very end.
There's some common misconceptions on who the shop keeper was that sold the key. It was Pink. After defeating her, Orange is with her watching the sunset in the store.
Something to do with how the flowers are the antithesis of the souls they represent?
Aqua is patience, represented by a little girl who's constantly rushing around to look for new and interesting things Purple is perseverance, represented by someone who doesn't want to push any sort of boundaries and is eager to flee Yellow is justice, represented by an outlaw with a poor sense of what's right and what's wrong Blue is integrity, implemented by someone with very little of it represented by someone who doesn't want to take part in a tragedic tale but insists on having a role in it anyway Orange is bravery, represented by a tiny animal who would prefer to cower behind a screen and take potshots when alone Green is kindness, but is represented by... uhhh... someone who'd rather not get involved? I guess? Green is kind of an outlier
Chef Gusteau once said "Anyone can cook!" but looking at this chapter, evidently not.
Unfortunately Asgore is more or less in the exact same position he was in before 5. He's so fucking vague that we can't know what his motives really are.
From what I've gathered, apparently Dess disappeared for some reason, a Dark World was involved, and Asgore was somehow blamed for it all. Probably by Toriel, knowing Toby.
He was being creepy, but it felt like he got a full character arc in chapter 5 despite not moving the story forward. He realized that he was a creep and his obsession pushed everyone away, so he was ready to let go. Then he got kidnapped, so nothing advanced.
I feel your pain because Asgore is the best written character in Undertale. In Deltarune he is completely passive and all of his evidence gathering literally amounts to nothing. He's more of a plot device than an actual character. As soon as it seems like he's about to develop and move on from Toriel he gets kidnapped by The Knight lol. Don't expect to see much more of him until the very end.
Is it just me, or does Asgore seem like Toby's personal whipping boy more than anything? Seriously, in both games he gets absolutely fucked over... and yet, we're supposed to just shrug it off in favor of lesbians and memes.
From what I've gathered, apparently Dess disappeared for some reason, a Dark World was involved, and Asgore was somehow blamed for it all. Probably by Toriel, knowing Toby.
It's straightforward told to you that nobody blamed him for anything. He blamed himself, and everyone left him for it. Altough, it seems, nobody quite realized that he didn't blamed himself for causing anything, just not preventing it, or solving what had happened, thinking of himself as a failure which eventually consumed him.
Is it just me, or does Asgore seem like Toby's personal whipping boy more than anything? Seriously, in both games he gets absolutely fucked over... and yet, we're supposed to just shrug it off in favor of lesbians and memes.
He's the incarnation of the typical heterosexual white men in the game. Of course he gets raked across the coal. It's not even hard to understand him and have sympathy for him, it's just that he's the most easy target.
