UK General Election

[Dudeofteenage]

Wouldn't Deputy PM be a demotion from Chancellor? Gordon Brown wasn't Deputy under Blair although he was the heir to Blair.

I'm assuming he'd be both. It seems that Cameron has something different in mind, though - he's made Osbourne First Secretary of State. Still effectively makes him the #2 in the government, presuming nobody gets appointed Deputy PM (and I can't imagine why they would)

I'm gonna keep disagreeing about Miliband being an innately poor leader. Whoever Labour had chosen, they'd have been depicted as a useless ineffectual twat by the press. It just goes with the job. As I said earlier, if Dave had been leader, we'd have been constantly hearing about how they should have gone with Ed, instead. Dave became every Tory's favourite leader the moment he lost the contest.

 

[Fareal]

Osborne named First Secretary of State (essentially Deputy PM but no title of Deputy) in addition to Chancellor. None of the great offices of state change hands. Most interesting.

 

[Vitriol]

thought id throw in my two pennies:

I'm pretty impressed by how the conservatives have done and disgusted at how quickly labour are turning on themselves- party grandees busy tearing the current guard down and accusing each other of being too blairite or too old labour. None f them seem to grasp yet that its patronising policies and a complete champagne socialist disconnect that did for them. They lost a lot of stronghold votes (if not seats) to ukip but are too caught up in a very 'liberal' mindset to see their stance on not giving people a say on europe and insisting there is no problem with islam and excessive immigration is costing them voters.

I quite liked farage's cheeky putinesque manoeuvre. he had me laughing- for a man of the people he's very slippery.

I'm fairly sure the snp vote will hold- they've got the holyrood election to galvanise for next year, then an eu referendum, then either a new indie ref or the next general election. I noticed separatist parties got 55% on a 73% turnout. Cameron will have to do something radical to avoid losing Scotland.

the lib dems got what they deserved i have no sympathy- I understand they couldn't fullfill all their pledges because of coalition but there a big difference between 'we can't scrap tuition fees because of coalition demands' and ' we can't scrap tuition fees instead we're going to treble them'.

FPTP is as broken as ever- greens and ukip both should have far more seats.

Will be interested to see if Osborne tries some victorianesque century-rents-for-a-pound type deals to rejuvenate the north. He spent a lot of the last parliament visiting what's left of the industries there and the few times he spoke during the election he kept emphasising the importance of rejuvenating the north and re balancing the economy away from London. If he was to succeed he could break labours last stronghold so he might try.

 

[JU 199]

Will be interested to see if Osborne tries some victorianesque century-rents-for-a-pound type deals to rejuvenate the north. He spent a lot of the last parliament visiting what's left of the industries there and the few times he spoke during the election he kept emphasising the importance of rejuvenating the north and re balancing the economy away from London. If he was to succeed he could break labours last stronghold so he might try.

Thats assuming Osborne wants to do anything about that. Historically he's had no problem letting the divide stay as it is.

 

[DuskEngine]

They lost a lot of stronghold votes (if not seats) to ukip but are too caught up in a very 'liberal' mindset to see their stance on not giving people a say on europe and insisting there is no problem with islam and excessive immigration is costing them voters.

Someone mentioned this earlier, I think, and it's curious to me -- why would someone swing from Labour to UKIP? Center-left to populist-right seems like more of a stretch than them voting, say, Greens or something. Is it just Labour's blue-collar base going single-issue on immigration?

 

[JU 199]

why would someone swing from Labour to UKIP? Center-left to populist-right seems like more of a stretch than them voting

(I'm asuming you're american) Our politics is a bit different here. What you mentioned is a possibility with some of the electorate. Labour's strategy assumed UKIP would poach more from the conservatives than they would from them. In a few constituencies it turned out to be the opposite.

What really tipped the balance was higher turnout and especially lib-dem defectors- Who against all predictions voted tory.

 

[Vitriol]

Thats amusing that Osborne wants to do anything about that. Historically he's had no problem letting the divide stay as it is.

I agree but now he has a chance to break labour and secure tory hegemony for the foreseeable future. Osborneis the heir to a baronetcy and an aristocrat- he's exactly the type of person who took advantage of the 18th century grants. its not like the rich have nothing to gain from being able to open up fresh businesses cheaply!

edit:labour-ukip @DawnMachine

labour used to be the party of the working class and were big on trade unions and the welfare state. Voting labour was part of class culture and loyalty. however since the mid 2000's mass immigration has damaged the wage of the working class and driven house prices up. Labour refuse to acknowledge this and for a long time labled anyone who disagreed with them racist. If your a plumber or joiner who's seen his wage collapse or unemployed and unable to get a job because all the low skilled labour contracts are held by agencies that recruit directly from East Europe and you cant move elsewhere because there isn't enough affordable housing you might be tempted to vote ukip instead of your typical labour.

You probaly won't vote tory out of class loyalty and ukip hold themselves out as ordinary blokes (this isn't really true but politics amirite!)

 

[CWCissey]

I think Osbourne will go through with his projects aimed at regenerating the North, he seems dead set on having an economic powerhouse up here, if anything just to shut us up about the country and the economy being too focused on London (which it is).

However, vanity projects like HS2 are not the answer.

 

[Venusaur]

Soooooo...do you guys think Cameron will deliver on the "Leaving the EU" referendum?

 

[DuskEngine]

(I'm asuming you're american)

Nah, I'm from the colonies, sahib.

Labour's strategy assumed UKIP would poach more from the conservatives than they would from them. In a few constituencies it turned out to be the opposite.

So Labour were banking on UKIP doing well and the Tories were banking on SNP doing well? I'm starting to get an impression of how bizarre this election was.

 

[CWCissey]

Soooooo...do you guys think Cameron will deliver on the "Leaving the EU" referendum?

He'll get some minor reforms then say 'lol, we don't need one now'.

So Labour were banking on UKIP doing well and the Tories were banking on SNP doing well? I'm starting to get an impression of how bizarre this election was.

Particularly as UKIP were targeting a lot of Labour seats, as they wanted to be the new working class party.

 

[Holdek]

I'm assuming he'd be both. It seems that Cameron has something different in mind, though - he's made Osbourne First Secretary of State. Still effectively makes him the #2 in the government, presuming nobody gets appointed Deputy PM (and I can't imagine why they would)

Yeah, I believe it's not uncommon not to have a Deputy PM.

 

[Vitriol]

Soooooo...do you guys think Cameron will deliver on the "Leaving the EU" referendum?

his majority is so small i think he'll have too but he'll hobble it like the 1979 scots referendum. 50% of the electorate needed not 50% of votes cast.

 

[CWCissey]

his majority is so small i think he'll have too but he'll hobble it like the 1979 scots referendum. 50% of the electorate needed not 50% of votes cast.

Even then, a lot of polls say around 80% of people in the UK would like to leave the EU, so hobbling the election wouldn't stop it if this is true.

 

[Vitriol]

Even then, a lot of polls say around 80% of people in the UK would like to leave the EU, so hobbling the election wouldn't stop it if this is true.

stick a two thirds majority of the total electorate down and you only have to win an extra 11%.

but in all honestly if 80% want out we should probably just go and he would stand to gain votes by offering an open referendum.

 

[JU 199]

So Labour were banking on UKIP doing well and the Tories were banking on SNP doing well? I'm starting to get an impression of how bizarre this election was.

Yes In my opinion this election was about labours bad habits coming to ahead.

The assumptions

1) We don't need a proper counter narrative. We'll poach popular shit from everyone elses agenda. 'People will like us then!'
2) Scotland will put out for us.
3) The lib-dems will vote for us
4) (Smaller) Ukip wont poach votes from us.

Even then, a lot of polls say around 80% of people in the UK would like to leave the EU

Most polls aren't that high. But they are about 50%

I think Cameron knows that leaving the EU isn't the best idea (from his perspective) and might punt, but it's probably a vote winner anyway.


If there was one casualty that made me smile it was Ed Balls. He was responsible for the modern PFI- a quasi-privatization drive that's cost my nation untold amounts of money now and in the future.

It was good to see him go.

Effectively labour propositioned a inferior shit sandwich.

If somebody walked up to you and told you that their shit sandwich was better than your shit sandwich, would you rather-

A) Have the shit sandwich you know
B) Have a potentially worse shit sandwich

Guess which option everyone took?

 

[CWCissey]

Anyway, if there was one casualty that made me smile it was Ed Balls. He was responsible for the modern PFI- a quasi-privatization drive that's cost my nation untold amounts of money now and in the future.

It was good to see him go.

Although I do wonder what will now happen to Ed Balls day.

 

[JU 199]

Although I do wonder what will now happen to Ed Balls day.

He'll probably leverage it for feels when his political career stalls again (I hope)

 

[GV 002]

Well bugger me, another 5 sodding years of Tories.

Bye bye NHS.

So long Chiltern Hills.

Hello austerity!

 

[Dudeofteenage]

I'm pretty impressed by how the conservatives have done and disgusted at how quickly labour are turning on themselves- party grandees busy tearing the current guard down and accusing each other of being too blairite or too old labour. None f them seem to grasp yet that its patronising policies and a complete champagne socialist disconnect that did for them.

So which is it? Labour needs unity, or Labour needs to get rid of champagne socialists?

He'll probably leverage it for feels when his political career stalls again (I hope)

For it to stall again it'd have to launch again, and that's beyond unlikely. He's toast. I guess it's conceivably possible that in some future Labour resurgence he might be able to crawl back in to a safe seat but any Labour leader with the minimum level of competence necessary to reverse Tory gains will know that Balls is toxic, along with pretty much this entire generation of Labour senior leadership.

Like Big Mils, the best Balls can hope for is a seat in the House of Lords and some kind of quango in ten years.