Law Texas lawmakers consider the death penalty for abortion - Would classify it as a homicide.

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Texas lawmakers consider the death penalty for abortion

State legislators stayed up well into the morning hearing emotional testimony about a proposed abortion ban.

www.fox5dc.com

State legislators stayed up well into the morning hearing emotional testimony about a proposed abortion ban.
House Bill 896 would criminalize abortion and classify it as a homicide. Women who have abortions could be sentenced to the death penalty.
How essentially one is okay with subjecting a woman to the death penalty for the exact… to do to her the exact same thing that one is alleging that she is doing to a child,” said State Rep. Victoria Neave, a Democrat from Dallas.

“I think it’s important to remember that if a drunk driver kills a pregnant woman, they get charged twice. If you murder a pregnant woman, you get charged twice. So I’m not specifically criminalizing women. What I’m doing is equalizing the law,” said State Rep. Tony Tinderholt, a Republican from Arlington.
The hearing in the House Judiciary Committee wrapped up at 3 a.m. Tuesday.
The bill now goes before the full Texas House for debate.

 

[MagneticTowels]

No. If they don't wish to allow the other person to have an abortion, then they should have the courage of their convictions and assume responsibility.

So... take on someone else's responsibility in the hopes that the other person will behave decently.

 

[XQ 076]

The rest of your post is more of your hogswallop argument about other people needing to be made to pay for the bad decision of people if they're going rightfully to criticize those bad decisions, and you attempting to disqualify me from having an opinion because I'm not a parent yet, since I'm 23. I don't think either of those non-arguments really warrant a response.

Ever heard of a book called Freakonomics? There’s a good argument that the price of a society where abortion is illegal are your downsides for increasing of the size of the underclass; increase in crime, increased burden on associated state services (police, prisons judicial) as well as welfare services. And abortions going on anyway illegally, as well as criminalising women and girls over the death of clumps of cells.

 

[Y2K Baby]

Ever heard of a book called Freakonomics? The price of a society where abortion is illegal are your downsides for increasing of the size of the underclass; increase in crime, increased burden on associated state services (police, prisons judicial) as well as welfare services. And abortions going on anyway illegally, as well as criminalising women and girls over the death of clumps of cells.

This only became a trend after birth control was legalize-

clump of cells

Nevermind, you're retar.ded, sorry.

 

[Autopsy]

ETA: the blood donation thing makes no sense to me at all. Donating blood has nothing to do with gestating a fetus, there are no parallels that can be accurately drawn. If you are that anemic, you would be given blood, not donating it as your donated blood couldn't be used. Blood is not an organ, either. It is a renewable resource. Donating it doesn't alter your body or put you at risk of dying. Even donating a kidney isn't comparable to pregnancy, though it is a more apt comparison than freaking donating blood.

"No parallels can be accurately drawn" if you discard analogies, yes.
That's why it was an analogy.
I'm not sure why people are having more trouble with that than with addressing abortions directly, given all the brutal irrationality abortion dredges up.
Anemia is the product state of donating blood. It is a rare enough thing, and preventative measures make it so, much unlike ye olde leeches and knives. Pregnancy is the product state of sex. Sex with contraceptives is a measure to prevent this outcome, which has made pregnancy a rare enough thing.
Blood is a tissue by definition (I was thinking of it as an organ due to the way it interacts with the lymph system), whoops, and it is indeed a renewable resource. Anemia heals in 2-3 weeks, pregnancy "heals" in 9 months, donating a kidney never heals. It's far from a better analogy on that merit alone, though clearly anemia isn't as impactful as pregnancy, so that's a fair point to make and one already considered twice now but these posts are huge so I can't blame anyone for not reading them.
Scale is not a necessary factor to determine culpability, though, which is what the analogy clears up best: the buck is going to stop somewhere, and the benefactor of all this is in the end a detached third party, no matter whose organs they've been thrust into or in this case whose blood has been thrust into them.
I'm not going to address the rest of that post for fear of further derailing this thread about a silly Texan law into a generic political discussion where it becomes increasingly clear there are fundamental value differences between the participants that will never be adequately addressed because they're uncomfortable to actually answer for and we're on the internet and Hahahahahahahaha How The Fuck Is Uncomfortable Shit Real Hahahaha Nigga Just Walk Away From The Screen Like Nigga Close Your Eyes Haha

 

[2nd_time_user]

Okay, making it a gender thing was exceptional, that's fair.

Instead, you should butt out of what medical procedures other people choose to get, period. Why is it your business if somebody gets an abortion any more than it's your business if they get gastric bypass surgery?

There's a widely held assumption that RETRY and IGNORE are gonna work out like ABORT.

 

[Jmz_33]

Texas really be like: “you either pro-life or get knifed.”

The death penalty is, to me, always kinda iffy, regardless of the crime.

 

[Y2K Baby]

The death penalty is, to me, always kinda iffy, regardless of the crime.

Unless it's for babies then it's covered under a right to privacy.

 

[cuddle striker]

you can't even force a child's own mother to donate blood to it.

the right to bodily autonomy is a thing you should be wary of destroying.

most anti abortion folks just want women to stop having sex unless they're owned by a man.

 

[MagneticTowels]

you can't even force a child's own mother to donate blood to it.

the right to bodily autonomy is a thing you should be wary of destroying.

most anti abortion folks just want women to stop having sex unless they're owned by a man.

If you refuse to feed your child, you go to jail.
If you refuse to house your child, you go to jail.
If you drive drunk, you go to jail.

 

[cuddle striker]

If you refuse to feed your child, you go to jail.
If you refuse to house your child, you go to jail.
If you drive drunk, you go to jail.

so? you can't force someone to donate blood or organs. you don't have to be an organ donor, even after you die. you've got to consent to it.

if your kid needs a kidney, you don't have to give it.

bodily autonomy also covers: the right to a DNR order, comfort care rather than being kept alive after brain death (Mama Nails!), vaccination for adults/home schooled kids, abortion and birth control, privacy for your medical records.
It's not even a slippery slope. Any one of those is wrecked, they're all fucked.

I'll bow out now because I can't go further without too much powerleveling.

 

[Casta Spersions]

"No parallels can be accurately drawn" if you discard analogies, yes.
That's why it was an analogy.
I'm not sure why people are having more trouble with that than with addressing abortions directly, given all the brutal irrationality abortion dredges up.
Anemia is the product state of donating blood. It is a rare enough thing, and preventative measures make it so, much unlike ye olde leeches and knives. Pregnancy is the product state of sex. Sex with contraceptives is a measure to prevent this outcome, which has made pregnancy a rare enough thing.
Blood is a tissue by definition (I was thinking of it as an organ due to the way it interacts with the lymph system), whoops, and it is indeed a renewable resource. Anemia heals in 2-3 weeks, pregnancy "heals" in 9 months, donating a kidney never heals. It's far from a better analogy on that merit alone, though clearly anemia isn't as impactful as pregnancy, so that's a fair point to make and one already considered twice now but these posts are huge so I can't blame anyone for not reading them.
Scale is not a necessary factor to determine culpability, though, which is what the analogy clears up best: the buck is going to stop somewhere, and the benefactor of all this is in the end a detached third party, no matter whose organs they've been thrust into or in this case whose blood has been thrust into them.
I'm not going to address the rest of that post for fear of further derailing this thread about a silly Texan law into a generic political discussion where it becomes increasingly clear there are fundamental value differences between the participants that will never be adequately addressed because they're uncomfortable to actually answer for and we're on the internet and Hahahahahahahaha How The Fuck Is Uncomfortable Shit Real Hahahaha Nigga Just Walk Away From The Screen Like Nigga Close Your Eyes Haha

I'm not uncomfortable, but I'm generally not here for political debate, and you are correct about having fundamental value differences - to me, this just means one is unlikely to be convinced regardless of argument.
I will say this though, anemia is not the product state of donating blood. Donating blood should not put an appropriate donor at any risk. It is the product state of iron deficiency through malnutrion, blood loss or (haha) pregnancy, although there are probably other causes that I don't feel like googling rn. It does not generally resolve in a few weeks, though that is entirely dependant on severity, treatment and other physiological factors. I wish it did!

Derail complete, thank you sir.

 

[LofaSofa]

pro life libtards BTFO

 

[Unpure]

Imagine all the innocent women in the same place as fucking serial killers lol.

They aren't innocent. They are murdering their own children

 

[Recoil]

And so the scale balances once again. Extremism on one side, extremism on the other.

 

[Krokodil Overdose]

Ever heard of a book called Freakonomics? There’s a good argument that the price of a society where abortion is illegal are your downsides for increasing of the size of the underclass; increase in crime, increased burden on associated state services (police, prisons judicial) as well as welfare services.

Do we want to come out and say how this correlates to which demographics have the highest rates of abortion, or is that a little too uncomfortable?

 

[Tasty Tatty]

having sex is not consent to pregnancy,

It somehow is as the final biological goal of sex is to procreate. I mean, if we're gonna bring biology, then let's bring biology. The sexual desire you feel over a person is in fact a desire to procreate with that someone.

Also, non-permanent birth control methods aren't 100% effective. There is always a chance that you can get pregnant or get someone pregnant even if you take the pill or wear a condom. Say, if you're drinking water and someone tells you that there is a 1% chances of getting poisoned by drinking it, would you? Well, with sex isn't that different. There is a chance that you can get pregnant even if you try to avoid it. Anybody who is about to have sex, especially young people, should be quite aware of this.


About the article, it's stupid, come on. You cannot be "pro-life" and be pro-death penalty. It's absurd. Both sides are spoiling any kind of reasonable debate on abortion by bringing feelings and politics into it. It's not about "women's rights" because there are more people involved, like the father and the child itself. And yes, it's a very specific case that should be deal with individually in its own context. Thing is, abortion already is legal in many places when either the mother is in great danger or the baby has zero chances from the start (see thread of deformed babies). Most doctors would agree on this. But, in the same way, many doctors respect life and for them life begins as conception. Why are people involved in the freaking humanities trying to say otherwise? We're bringing ethical debates in a medical discussion. And yes, of course there must be a solution to unwanted pregnancy for rape, but abortion shouldn't be the default solution for young people having unprotected or careless sex. What about close your fucking legs and be responsible? (and please, don't bring "but but but kids want to have sex anyway". Teach young people to have self-control. Nobody has ever died for waiting until finishing growing up to have sex).

 

[Buer]

That seems a bit extreme. Why not just forcibly sterilize the mother and put them in jail for 20 or more years or something like that? That law might actually pass unlike this one which will put a lot of the moderates off. I mean I think people who recklessly abort fetuses should be punished but I think the pro-lifers that think doing this will somehow change society for the better are pretty optimistic. We'd just get different problems. What @Mega Blooper said is right. And I don't think the state has enough resources to foot the bill for that many unwanted kids.

If the punishment I suggested is too harsh than maybe Nagant's solution would be better:

I've always kept my mouth shut IRL about that but ya. I think (but could be swayed in other directions) that ladies should get the first one for free with no judgement because we really all do make mistakes. I think they should also offer to do the second one free on the condition that if the abortion doctor ever sees her again he's going to sterilize her. I know its a super super small minority of people but I've known women who have had upwards of three abortions and nearly the same number of children confiscated by CPS. It's all so strange.

 

[Ido]

Google says it takes an average of 15 years between sentencing and execution, and looking up the Texas death row inmates some of them have been in there upwards of 25 years. That's a lot of government resources spent on these guys who are the lowest of the low. Now imagine keeping a woman locked up for that long after finding out a tad too late that her birth control fucked up. Like, we already gave a problem with people in jail for overcrowding, where are the actual violent offenders going to go if all the prisons are full?

Considering so many women are on birth control: Guys, the pills and iud's are not 100% relable, and in fact the way it works is the hormones are supposed to make your body think its pregnant. Speaking from experience the side effects can be God damn brutal, so after a while of taking it girls some times just try their best to block that shit out. If they are sexually active without condoms they should probably be testing themselves every so often but shit happens and chances are won't be caught right away. I was going to make a point about sterilization here but see my reply below.

Why not just forcibly sterilize the mother

Women have a hard enough time getting their tubes tied even if they want it so good luck with that logic. If you tell me I can get sterilized just from getting a few abortions rather than go through the shitty tube tying I'd be all in and legit do it. I know you mentioned jail too, but I'd risk it fuck it I hate kids and in 20 years time i might be old enough for them to consider possibly tying mine.

If y'all like kids so much go and adopt the ones that are alive because you wanted them to be, but lost intsrest in once you they were born.

You can hate my position all you want, but take a second to think about what would happen if it was the Male who gave birth to a watermelon size baby out of his dick hole. Then watch this and tell me you wouldn't abort it if you didnt completely want it.

 

[Feline Darkmage]

PRO LIFE

P R O
R
O

L I F E
I
F
E

 

[Death Grip]

To expand on the vasectomies idea. Every male upon achieving the age of 16, has a vasectomy after banking some sperm for future procreation purposes. If the male/family of the male feel that they may prefer a Duggar type family they can pay for extra banking of sperm before the vasectomy.
Ta-da, no more unwanted pregnancies.
What's that you say? This would be an infringement of bodily autonomy?
You mean along the same sort of lines as forcing a woman to continue a pregnancy to term?