Rugrats (2021) - paramount plus

[starborn427614]

I think for me it was the fact that she was so bland and one-note and had literally no purpose in the show other than to be black, and to a lesser extent, to be female. And when she did show up, like Tommy she never has any flaws or was ever wrong. Tokens are usually either stereotypes, or they lack any flaws and are just generically "nice" because for some reason writers think they'll be accused if istphobia if they show a minority character having flaws.

Hey Arnold I remember doing a much better job with having minority characters and actually fleshing them out instead of leaving them as shallow stereotypes or bland and undeveloped. I think because it had better writers and it came out a bit latter, after there had been years of criticism of tokenism and discussion of how to avoid it in writing. Meanwhile Rugrats came out right in the middle of when tokenism was at its peak. Shit is absolutely a product of it's time.

Gerald was the black best friend back in the day.

 

[Erika Furudo]

It's part of my childhood but a show I care little for. I seriously hope this reboot doesn't lead to other things getting rebooted, Courage, Dexter, etc. Just leave my childhood alone please.

 

[Dom Cruise]

Susie was fine if a little bland. I saw her as Bizarro Angelica, a nice kid who could challenge Angelica and keep her shit stirring in check and gave the babies a nice toddler to interact with.

Fine but a little bland is the best way to describe Susie, she didn't take anything away from the show when she was present, but nor did she really add anything of major note, I'm struggling to actually remember anything specific with her other than her introductory episode.

I guess we can all forget all grown up happened then.

The thing about All Grown Up is, it ended in 2008, who the hell was still watching Rugrats who saw it when it was new when they were kids by the year 2008? Chances are you'd be around 18, which is the age I was, or even older, imagine still watching a Rugrats show uninterrupted by the time your 18 or even older lmao.

I forgive people for revisiting shows from their childhood when they're old enough to really be nostalgic, but everyone should go through that period when you're a teen where you move on to other interests, on the flipside most actual kids in the mid-2000s would probably not have been much interested in All Grown Up since they would not have been as familiar with Rugrats and thus a special context to the show would have been lost, which is probably why it's pretty obscure today, heck I still can't believe they really made a show where they were teens, the whole idea is weird.

Maybe Nick was thinking that if the characters were teens, teens who grew up watching the original show would be watching? But it seems it didn't work out that way much, if at all.

It's part of my childhood but a show I care little for. I seriously hope this reboot doesn't lead to other things getting rebooted, Courage, Dexter, etc. Just leave my childhood alone please.

I kinda hope they leave my 90s childhood alone as well, but I do think it would be interesting if we got some Space Ghost: Coast to Coast/Harvey Birdman Attorney At Law/Sealab 2021 style spoofs of 90s shows for audiences that grew up with them and are now adults.

As a matter of fact, what would a show where the Rugrats are now fully grown adults and it addresses actual adult themes, but in that same surreal Klasky Csupo world be like? Picture something like a cross between the tone of Duckman and Rugrats, that'd be funny as fuck actually.

 

[queenvi]

The thing about All Grown Up is, it ended in 2008, who the hell was still watching Rugrats who saw it when it was new when they were kids by the year 2008? Chances are you'd be around 18, which is the age I was, or even older, imagine still watching a Rugrats show uninterrupted by the time your 18 or even older lmao.

I forgive people for revisiting shows from their childhood when they're old enough to really be nostalgic, but everyone should go through that period when you're a teen where you move on to other interests, on the flipside most actual kids in the mid-2000s would probably not have been much interested in All Grown Up since they would not have been as familiar with Rugrats and thus a special context to the show would have been lost, which is probably why it's pretty obscure today, heck I still can't believe they really made a show where they were teens, the whole idea is weird.

Maybe Nick was thinking that if the characters were teens, teens who grew up watching the original show would be watching? But it seems it didn't work out that way much, if at all.

I agree that it was a complete waste of time - as someone who grew up with Rugrats, and was more the demographic they were probably aiming for with All Grown Up, since I would have been 14. However, even if the show didn't work, I always feel really strange when they reboot a series and/or completely forget about a spin-off show or a sequel they did. It just seems odd to me, even if they just kind of want to forget they ever made it.

 

[Kulee Baba]

Oh Rugrats, a charming cartoon that parents and kids could both enjoy, which then went to total shit as the original writers either left or stopped caring. Watch the original short, it's such a simple and charming concept: what if babies were in fact intelligent but hilariously naive. As opposed to being tiny tabula rasas.

IMO I feel the original concept was clearly channelling the basic idea set forth by Calvin & Hobbes. Seeing things from a child's perspective and their imaginations run wild while the parents hilariously deal with the fallout. It's such a charming concept. The early episodes were also brilliant in how the show communicated to even children why bratty bullies like Angelica are so horrendously awful? Because their parents stupidly spoil them. It also wasn't afraid to mock quack child psychologists in the form of Dr. Lipschitz who wss a total hack.

Why would a show like this need to be CGI in the first place? It looks like a fucking video game.

 

[Android raptor]

Gerald was the black best friend back in the day.

He actually had a personality though beyond just being generically nice. Susie didn't have any real personality or characterization, she was just nice.

I'm sure reboot Susie will be far more insufferable though. Granted I know back when they did a Kwanzaa episode with her, which I don't remember watching but I'm sure was a disaster.

 

[starborn427614]

He actually had a personality though beyond just being generically nice. Susie didn't have any real personality or characterization, she was just nice.

I'm sure reboot Susie will be far more insufferable though. Granted I know back when they did a Kwanzaa episode with her, which I don't remember watching but I'm sure was a disaster.

That's what I meant yeah, he's the best example of how to do it right. Susie I can't remember having any standout episodes unlike the other characters.

 

[TopCat]

It's part of my childhood but a show I care little for. I seriously hope this reboot doesn't lead to other things getting rebooted, Courage, Dexter, etc. Just leave my childhood alone please.

Dexter's Lab was already rebooted, albeit in 2001 and just a couple of years after the original show ended. The original show (series 1-2) was produced at Hanna-Barbera but the new series was produced by Cartoon Network themselves, under the direction of the disgraced Chris Savino.

 

[Android raptor]

That's what I meant yeah, he's the best example of how to do it right. Susie I can't remember having any standout episodes unlike the other characters.

I remember a few episodes focused on her (other than the Kwanzaa episode I never saw), but she probably had the least episodes centered on her out of the characters. The few episodes are probably part of why I hated her so much, I remember they really made it obvious how she had nothing to her as a character beyond always being nice and good. Even as a kid I just couldn't stand characters like that, I didn't find them interesting or relatable.

I remember liking the twins the best as a kid, probably cause constantly making fart jokes and eating gross stuff made them funny and interesting to kid me. It seemed like they got the least focus after Susie though.

I also remember the show getting more and more focused on moral lessons and less focused on jokes over time. That's probably also why I ended up hating it so much as a kid (I don't think any kids like preachy moral lessons, but I really didn't like it as a kid. Still don't tbh).

 

[starborn427614]

I also remember the show getting more and more focused on moral lessons and less focused on jokes over time. That's probably also why I ended up hating it so much as a kid (I don't think any kids like preachy moral lessons, but I really didn't like it as a kid. Still don't tbh).

I get that, you just want to have fun when you're a kid. I was eager to watch any kind of television so I probably took to that sort of thing a lot better than most and it's a thing that's stuck with me. I don't really find moralfag shit annoying so long as what's surrounding it is enjoyable enough. Different strokes, of course.

 

[Android raptor]

I get that, you just want to have fun when you're a kid. I was eager to watch any kind of television so I probably took to that sort of thing a lot better than most and it's a thing that's stuck with me. I don't really find moralfag shit annoying so long as what's surrounding it is enjoyable enough. Different strokes, of course.

I think it's because really badly written moralfagging gets annoying even to a kid. As a kid you get enough nagging from parents and teachers, when you watch shit you want a break from that. Plus in the end I ended up preferring more action oriented and weeb shit. By the really late 90s/early 00s I think I barely watched nick, I preferred CN and Kids WB/Fox Kids because that's what had DBZ/Pokemon/Digimon/etc.

Hell, I kinda doubt I'm the only weeb that first started watching anime in part because I wanted something more action-oriented without annoying moral lessons like a lot of American cartoons at the time had. You also didn't have tokenism in anime either, because Japan doesn't give a fuck about that shit.

Shit, wasn't a lot of bad moral fagging and character writing in American cartoons in the 80s/90s the result of FCC and other guidelines that required kids shows to have a minimum amount of educational content and minority characters or whatever?

 

[starborn427614]

I think it's because really badly written moralfagging gets annoying even to a kid. As a kid you get enough nagging from parents and teachers, when you watch shit you want a break from that. Plus in the end I ended up preferring more action oriented and weeb shit. By the really late 90s/early 00s I think I barely watched nick, I preferred CN and Kids WB/Fox Kids because that's what had DBZ/Pokemon/Digimon/etc.

Hell, I kinda doubt I'm the only weeb that first started watching anime in part because I wanted something more action-oriented without annoying moral lessons like a lot of American cartoons at the time had. You also didn't have tokenism in anime either, because Japan doesn't give a fuck about that shit.

Shit, wasn't a lot of bad moral fagging and character writing in American cartoons in the 80s/90s the result of FCC and other guidelines that required kids shows to have a minimum amount of educational content and minority characters or whatever?

It does seem like there's been a switch from "having to include" to "wanting to include" in recent years. Regardless of what others feel about the situation, it feels more organic as opposed to the 90's.

 

[Android raptor]

It does seem like there's been a switch from "having to include" to "wanting to include" in recent years. Regardless of what others feel about the situation, it feels more organic as opposed to the 90's.

Yeah, I think that's also what makes tokens tokens as well. They aren't organically included, they're characters created solely to fill a quota. It feels jarring and patronizing to the viewer, especially to minority viewers who are being denied actual good representation.

I'm a little surprised one of the guys involved in the NSFW storyboard got busted for actually being a pedo, just because the storyboard thing sounded like they were intentionally trying to come up with the most crude and inappropriate shit they could. Like a Round Robin version of The Aristocrats. My first thought wouldn't be that the people involved were actual pedos any more than anyone else engaging in shock humor, and the reaction to the storyboard at the time seemed extreme. I can buy that most animators are weirdos though, most being harmless but a few being real suck fucks like John K and other kiddie diddlers.

 

[Dom Cruise]

Oh Rugrats, a charming cartoon that parents and kids could both enjoy, which then went to total shit as the original writers either left or stopped caring. Watch the original short, it's such a simple and charming concept: what if babies were in fact intelligent but hilariously naive. As opposed to being tiny tabula rasas.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=FOKIW_5iaUw
IMO I feel the original concept was clearly channelling the basic idea set forth by Calvin & Hobbes. Seeing things from a child's perspective and their imaginations run wild while the parents hilariously deal with the fallout. It's such a charming concept. The early episodes were also brilliant in how the show communicated to even children why bratty bullies like Angelica are so horrendously awful? Because their parents stupidly spoil them. It also wasn't afraid to mock quack child psychologists in the form of Dr. Lipschitz who wss a total hack.

Why would a show like this need to be CGI in the first place? It looks like a fucking video game.

When they started making new episodes after a break for a few years in 1997 I was so hyped as a kid, it was a "finally!" moment, but that was one of the first times pop culture really let me down, as when Rugrats came back it was a lot blander, there were a few good episodes but overall it was simply not as good as the show originally was and I never knew why until eventually reading up on the internet about the departure of writer Paul Germain, who seemed to be one of the key reasons that made the show as good as it first was.

Dexter's Lab was already rebooted, albeit in 2001 and just a couple of years after the original show ended. The original show (series 1-2) was produced at Hanna-Barbera but the new series was produced by Cartoon Network themselves, under the direction of the disgraced Chris Savino.

And that reboot was awful, just fucking awful, they ended it on such a high note with the Ego Trip movie and then mucked it up just a couple of years later, but at least it's very easy to just pretend that reboot didn't exist.

 

[MysticMisty]

When they started making new episodes after a break for a few years in 1997 I was so hyped as a kid, it was a "finally!" moment, but that was one of the first times pop culture really let me down, as when Rugrats came back it was a lot blander, there were a few good episodes but overall it was simply not as good as the show originally was and I never knew why until eventually reading up on the internet about the departure of writer Paul Germain, who seemed to be one of the key reasons that made the show as good as it first was.

I felt exactly the same way all those years ago. I didn't think all the new episodes were outright bad (at that point), but they definitely didn't hit nearly as good as the earlier ones either. Like, the one where they travel across the playground looking for water after Grandpa breaks a water main is almost as good as some of the earlier episodes, but it still falls far short of the best ones. And the previously non-existent moralfagging was just awful.

But overall it was still watchable, until Dil joined the cast. After that episodes like the one where they travel across the playground looking for water wouldn't even happen because Dil made poopie, gotta sit stand next to him and talk about the adventure they could've had instead.

 

[Dom Cruise]

I felt exactly the same way all those years ago. I didn't think all the new episodes were outright bad (at that point), but they definitely didn't hit nearly as good as the earlier ones either. Like, the one where they travel across the playground looking for water after Grandpa breaks a water main is almost as good as some of the earlier episodes, but it still falls far short of the best ones. And the previously non-existent moralfagging was just awful.

But overall it was still watchable, until Dil joined the cast. After that episodes like the one where they travel across the playground looking for water wouldn't even happen because Dil made poopie, gotta sit stand next to him and talk about the adventure they could've had instead.

That was exactly my experience with it as well, thought it was blander when it came back but still watched but fell off hard after Dil joined the series, although I did like that Dil era episode where they're at a drive in theater.

But not only was the writing blander, the animation was blander too, lacking that certain "pop" it had in the early 90s, but I really struggle to remember any specific episodes or specific plots of the show post 1997 at all whereas I can clearly remember episodes from the earlier seasons even though I haven't seen most of them since the 90s, that right there is a clear sign of the difference in quality.

But it really can't be understated just how fucking bad a character Dil was, what were they even thinking? Why was he added in the first place?

It really makes me wish the early seasons of Rugrats had had something that could have acted as a finale, almost all of those early 90s Nicktoons had an issue where they just... stopped, with no episode that could act a finale, with I think only Rocko getting a proper finale, I always felt left hanging as a kid by the Nicktoons, they're much like anime that way lol.

 

[Android raptor]

Yeah I definitely remember that as well, the earlier episodes being a bit more enjoyable and less preachy with the moralfagging. It makes sense to hear that one of the main writers left, I think I kinda figured something like that must have happened.

Funny enough I don't remember hating Dil like I do Susie and Tommy, but I don't remember much about him at all. I think he was just kinda.... there. You could have probably replaced him with an animal or an object or something and it would've been the same. I remember Kimi being ok, like she actually had a bit of a personality unlike Susie or Dil but by the time she was introduced the show had long since degraded into preachy moral lessons above all else.

I think overall Rugrats was probably a pretty mediocre show that suffered from a lot of bad writing issues common in kids shows at the time. I haven't watched it in years and I can't say I want to. I think people have a lot of nostalgia for it though, and that's the main reason anyone acts like it was amazing.

A Current Year reboot might be enough of a disaster to be worth watching, especially since thanks to SJWs tokenism is currently having a Renaissance. You know nothing good will be done with Susie, but it might be awful enough to be entertaining.

 

[Seth MacFartman]

Let me put it in the best way possible, "We're Doomed!"

 

[A Grey Cat]

That was exactly my experience with it as well, thought it was blander when it came back but still watched but fell off hard after Dil joined the series, although I did like that Dil era episode where they're a drive in theater.

But not only was the writing blander, the animation was blander too, lacking that certain "pop" it had in the early 90s, but I really struggle to remember any specific episodes or specific plots of the show post 1997 at all whereas I can clearly remember episodes from the earlier seasons even though I haven't seen most of them since the 90s, that right there is a clear sign of the difference in quality.

But it really can't be understated just how fucking bad a character Dil was, what were they even thinking? Why was he added in the first place?

It really makes me wish the early seasons of Rugrats had had something that could have acted as a finale, almost all of those early 90s Nicktoons had an issue where they just... stopped, with no episode that could act a finale, with I think only Rocko getting a proper finale, I always felt left hanging as a kid by the Nicktoons, they're much like anime that way lol.

Nickelodeon actually had a policy that no nicktoon could have a proper Finale at all. This was done so they could keep airing reruns of their shows while making kids think more episodes would be made if there was no definite episode that said the end it's over bye have a beautiful time

 

[Chad Holdenford]

Nickelodeon actually had a policy that no nicktoon could have a proper Finale at all. This was done so they could keep airing reruns of their shows while making kids think more episodes would be made if there was no definite episode that said the end it's over bye have a beautiful time

Yep, and IIRC, Angry Beavers had a finale that addressed all of those issues, with Norb and Dag becoming aware they're cartoon characters stuck on an endless loop of reruns. Obviously, the Nick execs were not amused in the least and canned the episode.