Open Source Software Community - it's about ethics in Code of Conducts

[HootersMcBoobies]

Lunduke videos are now 1000% more tolerable as he removed his fucking ugly Jew face from them. Now it's just pixel art and some sound level animation.

When he's not splurging out about his love of Israel, he's making some good points. He's certainly not wrong in this video about all the insane shit Linux distributions are now packaging.

 

[volatile puar]

I know it's a Brodie Robertson video, but I find his reporting to be high quality when there's no party line to tow.

tl;dw Fedora is considering cratering their install base (also Bazzite might be forced to shut down entirely) because "We cannot allow proprietary software that we cannot fix to hold back Fedora development."
Of course, it's not a good thing that Linux needs to bow to the laziness of Valve, who doesn't have any excuse to still have 32-bit dependencies, but it's not exactly any worse than already bowing to the whims of the outright malicious Red Hat, or any number of trannies in CoC committees or development roles.

 

[skunt]

Lunduke videos

I know it's a Brodie Robertson video

It's funny that our choices are an insufferable soyjakker or a camp neckbeard wearing a trilby. I think open source stuff doesn't really lend itself well to video coverage for some reason - maybe i'm a retard or maybe it's because the people that cover it have a political slant and there's nobody doing actual unbiased stuff.
Anyways the only channel i watch semi frequently now is fireship. Kevin Fang is brilliant but his videos aren't really news, and they're few and far between. Gamer nexus worth a mention too but that's hardware.

 

[teriyakiburns]

Interesting. Does Steam’s OS for their Switch-like handheld device (the name of it escapes me at the moment) use Wayland?

Last time I checked, steam deck uses wayland for the steam interface and games, but it switches to Xorg for the KDE desktop. There was a minor drama around Steam's contributions to wayland, which I believe is somewhere in the thread. Long story short, the wayland devs were being incredibly anal about accepting updates from Steam that would have fixed a bunch of performance issues, because it meant acknowledging that they were wrong about something. The dispute held back SteamOS development for quite a while, IIRC.

 

[sniffingaround]

Using the keyboard LEDs was a good idea, though it's kinda awkward to hold the keyboard up by your screen while recording.

I got a proof of concept going with a sysfs triggerable kernel module. I'll update the thread later with initial test results and code once I clean it up.

Wholesome

 

[CrunkLord420]

It's funny that our choices are an insufferable soyjakker or a camp neckbeard wearing a trilby. I think open source stuff doesn't really lend itself well to video coverage for some reason - maybe i'm a retard or maybe it's because the people that cover it have a political slant and there's nobody doing actual unbiased stuff.
Anyways the only channel i watch semi frequently now is fireship. Kevin Fang is brilliant but his videos aren't really news, and they're few and far between. Gamer nexus worth a mention too but that's hardware.

If you don't kowtow to the corpo-trannies then you get turned into PUNISHED LUNDUKE. Who would want to deal with that? Too niche, too toxic.

 

[Cuckoman]

This whole XLibre drama has made me seriously consider putting together a full trip mouse-to-monitor latency testing rig for Xorg/XLibre/Wayland. The Wayland people are non-stop gaslighting us with bullshit. I remember when "BETTER PERFORMANCE" was like THE selling point of Wayland 15 years ago, not this "no-tearing, perfect frame" crap they say now. That has disappeared because any performance difference is usually within the margin of error. The reality is Wayland feels slow (to me). I don't care if there's technically multiple cursors on the screen at the same time due to tearing, my eyeballs and brains filter it out, but I definitely feel it when my cursor is vsync'd.

Please do. I would love to see this.
Both because it would be very useful information. If it identifies deficiencies then it is a good metric and test for developers that would like to address them.
But also it would be very funny if Wayland would turn out to not be significantly faster and better than old X.

 

[For Scorn and Three Birds]

Last time I checked, steam deck uses wayland for the steam interface and games, but it switches to Xorg for the KDE desktop. There was a minor drama around Steam's contributions to wayland, which I believe is somewhere in the thread. Long story short, the wayland devs were being incredibly anal about accepting updates from Steam that would have fixed a bunch of performance issues, because it meant acknowledging that they were wrong about something. The dispute held back SteamOS development for quite a while, IIRC.

Makes sense. Ego is the payment for FOSS. Sooner or later, FOSS and the communitys round it are going to have to confront, that just because you don't take money.
Does not mean that no currency is changing hands. That you have unwarranted self important assholes at critical points, who can stall things because they don't ever want to admit they are wrong.
Just remember it took a corpo to get games running on Linux. After the WINE team's refusal to even consider if DXVK was good.
All they cared about was how they looked, if an upstart embarrassed them after 10 years trying to get mainsteam gaming to work.

 

[Not Yet Implemented]

Sooner or later, FOSS and the communitys round it are going to have to confront, that just because you don't take money.
Does not mean that no currency is changing hands.

Not gratis, libre.

Ego is the payment for FOSS.

I think plenty of people, including prominent figures, realize this.

 

[AmpleApricots]

This whole XLibre drama has made me seriously consider putting together a full trip mouse-to-monitor latency testing rig for Xorg/XLibre/Wayland. The Wayland people are non-stop gaslighting us with bullshit.

Reminds me of the time the linux journal tested terminal emulators (even the fancy nutech ones like alacritty who use rust, the GPU and everything) and came to the conclusion that good ol' xterm is in fact the most low latency one compared to some others even by far.

The xorg server often gets named (honestly, parroted rather because I think many people who say it have no idea what they're talking about and just repeat what they heard somewhere) as huge and impractical codebase. That might've been true... in the 90s. For modern sensibilities, it really is not that complex and is just another one of these arguments that don't stand up to serious scrutiny, especially if you consider that basically every WM/DE has to come up with it's own stack of solutions for simple things that are a given in X with wayland.

video coverage

It's because video coverage in general is complete ass for complex topics. Death to youtubers.

 

[For Scorn and Three Birds]

I think plenty of people, including prominent figures, realize this.

So how come they do nothing about it when faggots stall/block and make things difficult? They don't even dare call the guy a faggot for doing it.
Wayland could have been finished by now, if we did not have to go round having committees on having a committee on getting the software finished.

Not gratis, libre.

You are free, free to do as we tell you or else.
If the libre was true, you would not have Xlibre and Wayland devs trying to fuck each other over and cancel culture each other.

 

[Not Yet Implemented]

So how come they do nothing about it when faggots stall/block and make things difficult?

The usual solution to such disagreements is forking, which is what Xlibre is.

They don't even dare call the guy a faggot for doing it.

Linus still ripped marcan a new one for drama queen behavior.

You are free, free to do as we tell you or else.

CoCs are in effect a play to do this. They also regularly try to subvert committees for the same end. Progtroons generally have been enjoying some measure of success by singling out key figures and removing them on trumped up accusations.

If the libre was true, you would not have Xlibre and Wayland devs trying to fuck each other over and cancel culture each other

But still, what are you smoking? First of all, it's clearly a one-sided sabotage attempt from the Wayland camp towards X11, which is what Xlibre is meant to address. Where do you see Xlibre people trying to "fuck each other over" and "cancel culture" wayland people? Some guy forked X11 and continued working on it. That's software freedom working as intended.

 

[For Scorn and Three Birds]

That's software freedom working as intended.

Not really. He is beeing harrased till he gives up. They are pulling leavers to make sure to bury the project.
"Fork it" the biggest joke in tech.
I said both sides because now the wayland devs have people spamming TTD at them. Giving them the perfect shield of playing victim.

 

[analrapist]

One of the notions I had about Fedora's weird behaviour is that all of a sudden, the Linux ecosystem has a new player, the SteamDeck. Android was foreign enough that it didn't present any issues. But with the pulling of i686 stuff, along with dropping X, GNOME moving to SystemD, etc., Fedora's moving to create a new baseline for their Linux that isn't entirely compatible with Decktards because they don't want to be bothered with supporting them. Perhaps part of it, too, is Fedora and Valve collaborating behind the scenes to decrease the complexity of the SteamDeck OS.

 

[volatile puar]

Not gratis, libre.

Not free as in beer, nor freeze as in peach, but freak as in queer.

 

[GoysGoneWild]

I still lean towards "they feel threatened for the first time ever".

GNOME is cratering. KDE is eating their lunch outside of default Fedora/RHEL installs and shilling on r/Linux.
Their Wayland bullshit is increasingly getting called out just as their screechmaxxing about it being "fine" or "feature complete" is reaching a crescendo. From both the organic, grassroots side in Xlibre, which exposed how badly they had gimped the Linux desktop for years. And from the powerful corporate side in Steam, which forked Wayland with frog-protocols a shirt time ago to give them a slap in the face and tell them to get back to work.

These people are not used to being opposed, no matter if it is from the chuddy side in Xlibre, or with another corporation like Steam. Even if they have momentum, the idea of a competent opponent able to resist them is a novelty and causes the amygdala to go haywire.

 

[volatile puar]

One of the notions I had about Fedora's weird behaviour is that all of a sudden, the Linux ecosystem has a new player, the SteamDeck. Android was foreign enough that it didn't present any issues. But with the pulling of i686 stuff, along with dropping X, GNOME moving to SystemD, etc., Fedora's moving to create a new baseline for their Linux that isn't entirely compatible with Decktards because they don't want to be bothered with supporting them. Perhaps part of it, too, is Fedora and Valve collaborating behind the scenes to decrease the complexity of the SteamDeck OS.

Removing 32-bit support doesn't hurt the Steamdeck any more than it hurts any other distro that wants to have gamers using their distro, and besides that, the Fedora team didn't realize that it broke Steam until it was pointed out to them that the flatpak doesn't work, which seems to have put the breaks on the plan. Also Fedora removing 32 bit would not affect SteamOS at all since it's their own distro which is based on Arch, not Fedora. Finally, if Fedora was collaborating with Valve, what would actually happen is that Valve would get off their ass and remove 32-bit dependencies from Steam, by which I mean, port the already 64-bit only Steam app they developed for MacOS to Linux, which would be fairly easy since MacOS is Unix. The only thing happening here is that they wanted to stop supporting i686 because it has become annoying, and they didn't realize removing 32-bit support would be so controversial.

 

[Betonhaus]

What would a "WX11" or something look like that brings compatibility for Wayland code into X11?

 

[GoysGoneWild]

Removing 32-bit support doesn't hurt the Steamdeck any more than it hurts any other distro that wants to have gamers using their distro, and besides that, the Fedora team didn't realize that it broke Steam until it was pointed out to them that the flatpak doesn't work, which seems to have put the breaks on the plan. Also Fedora removing 32 bit would not affect SteamOS at all since it's their own distro which is based on Arch, not Fedora. Finally, if Fedora was collaborating with Valve, what would actually happen is that Valve would get off their ass and remove 32-bit dependencies from Steam, by which I mean, port the already 64-bit only Steam app they developed for MacOS to Linux, which would be fairly easy since MacOS is Unix. The only thing happening here is that they wanted to stop supporting i686 because it has become annoying, and they didn't realize removing 32-bit support would be so controversial.

If anything, Fedora doing that would just help SteamOS marketshare, even if likely a tiny bit. The troon-sheltering Bazzite devs made it clear they would basically shut down if such a move would occur. Those users would likely just migrate to SteamOS, Arch, Cachy, Nobara, etc.

What would a "WX11" or something look like that brings compatibility for Wayland code into X11?

I think you just mean XWayland?

 

[Pooners Paradise]

I still lean towards "they feel threatened for the first time ever".

GNOME is cratering. KDE is eating their lunch outside of default Fedora/RHEL installs and shilling on r/Linux.
Their Wayland bullshit is increasingly getting called out just as their screechmaxxing about it being "fine" or "feature complete" is reaching a crescendo. From both the organic, grassroots side in Xlibre, which exposed how badly they had gimped the Linux desktop for years. And from the powerful corporate side in Steam, which forked Wayland with frog-protocols a shirt time ago to give them a slap in the face and tell them to get back to work.

These people are not used to being opposed, no matter if it is from the chuddy side in Xlibre, or with another corporation like Steam. Even if they have momentum, the idea of a competent opponent able to resist them is a novelty and causes the amygdala to go haywire.

It's gotten so bad that Fedora actually has KDE as an Official Edition that shows up on the homepage next to the GNOME option and not hidden in the spins anymore.