MRA debate

[Datiko]

I don't align with the MRA movement but I am sick of how narrow-minded supposed progressives can be when faced with viewpoints that don't fit the narrative. Recently I made the mistake of going out with some grad-school folk visiting from America. I kept quiet as the usual "political" topics were cycled through until Abortion came up. My opinion is that abortion should be freely available as only a woman is fit to know if they are ready to face the risks of pregnancy. Of course this played well with the group until I followed it up with my belief that the decision of the male should also be registered to determine liability for child support. Rather than debate the topic it turned into the same litany of "progressive" labels being attached to me culminating in acquisitions of me being an MRA.

MRA aren't the problem. The problem is a generation who doesn't understand basic concepts like "the exception doesn't make the rule", "Stereo-types are bad", and "its OK to challenge even the most reasonable sounding ideas". I blame sites like twitter and tumbler where well structured discussions are impossible based on the format; where simple privacy features ensure no opposing viewpoints can ever break into the echo chamber. The difference between a discussion and an argument has been lost to most of the political spectrum.

 

[MACH-IV]

I don't align with the MRA movement but I am sick of how narrow-minded supposed progressives can be when faced with viewpoints that don't fit the narrative. Recently I made the mistake of going out with some grad-school folk visiting from America. I kept quiet as the usual "political" topics were cycled through until Abortion came up. My opinion is that abortion should be freely available as only a woman is fit to know if they are ready to face the risks of pregnancy. Of course this played well with the group until I followed it up with my belief that the decision of the male should also be registered to determine liability for child support. Rather than debate the topic it turned into the same litany of "progressive" labels being attached to me culminating in acquisitions of me being an MRA.

MRA aren't the problem. The problem is a generation who doesn't understand basic concepts like "the exception doesn't make the rule", "Stereo-types are bad", and "its OK to challenge even the most reasonable sounding ideas". I blame sites like twitter and tumbler where well structured discussions are impossible based on the format; where simple privacy features ensure no opposing viewpoints can ever break into the echo chamber. The difference between a discussion and an argument has been lost to most of the political spectrum.

I tip my fedora to you, good sir. Who is your favorite PUA?

ps: this post is satirical. think about how true it is.

 

[Dr. Meme]

why hate feminists when you can just hate furries

 

[Datiko]

I tip my fedora to you, good sir. Who is your favorite PUA?

ps: this post is satirical. think about how true it is.

pss I dont know what PUA is

 

[Dr. Meme]

ps: this post is satirical. think about how true it is.

I tip my fedora to you, good sir

never would have guessed

 

[MACH-IV]

pss I dont know what PUA is

You can look past social norms to rationally discuss big-picture problems within modern society so you must be a PUA. You've already made it perfectly clear you're an MRA.

 

[Datiko]

You can look past social norms to rationally discuss big-picture problems within modern society so you must be a PUA. You've already made it perfectly clear you're an MRA.

I'm not trying to play dumb. I really don't know what a PUA is. Its hard to tell what you're satirizing when I don't understand what you mean.

 

[SU 390]

Wow there sure is a lot of IMMATURE and IRRATIONAL negativity on this thread. Lol okay children. Pretty telling that simply the idea of men being treated equally is so threatening to you because it should be. Men have been the most oppressed class throughout all of history. Who did all the work while women basically lazed around at home playing with the kids? Men. Who had to fight in all the wars and risk their lives and often die, while women sat around gossiping and having sewing circles. Men. But now all that's about to change. For the last 10,000 years or so women have secretly controlled the world with lies and deceit and let idiots and sheeple think men were in charge with deceptive contructs like "the patriarchy" but now sheeple are finally being redpilled and getting the wool taken out from their eyes. Yeah, I'd be scared too if my femiluminati narrative was crumbling down.

I'm happy to debate you guys but I think the echochamber is just too strong here, you're all brainwashed and feminized from your tumblr hugboxes. If you ever want to drop by /r/mensrights we can have a proper discussion and you'll see just how wrong and stupid you are from the sheer weight of downvotes you get.

This is should be a copypasta.

 

[HG 400]

I'm not trying to play dumb. I really don't know what a PUA is. Its hard to tell what you're satirizing when I don't understand what you mean.

Pick-Up Artists. Dudes who follow an organised strategy to fuck chicks, which usually relies on dressing like unbearable attentionwhores and then acting mildly insulting towards the chick to play off her insecurities. Feminists hate them fiercely and a small subsect of MRAs (Elliot Rodgers brand, if I remember right) also hate them fiercely. Most people who don't care about dumb politics just see them as sad, attention-craving sluts who never got hugged enough as children, and who now dress up like faggots and bang club-whores to make up for it.

 

[Vitriol]

To illustrate a point i made earlier about the general public being sympathetic to male issues and the comparative incompetency of the MRA movement.

Jessica Valenti has written a guardian piece that is terrible even by her low standards. At the time of posting the article has 2000+ comments calling her out on her sexist views.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/13/feminists-do-not-hate-men

Its obvious that there is widely held support and awareness for mens issues. To blame a tiny minority of feminist sjw's, whom it is obvious from comments the public see right through, is a nonsense.

Mra's are not respected for the same reason sjw's arent. They boil everything down to a simple us v them narrative replacing 'patriarchy' with 'feminism'.

Most sane people quite rightly see the truth is far more complex and dismiss both sides as more interested in attacking the enemy than actual equality.

 

[MACH-IV]

Its obvious that there is widely held support and awareness for mens issues.

It's obvious where? Even a thread meant to discuss men's issues just turns into people talking about why feminism is good and MRAs are bad. What does feminism have to do with men's issues? How can it help? Why does it need to? The only reason people even bring up men's issues is to bash MRAs and talk about why feminism is good. It's wrong to blame feminism for causing men's issues, but feminism can't help solve them either. Saying feminism can't help hurts feelings because it gets interpreted as an attack against feminism. If it's not directly promoting the feminist agenda, it has to be evil, right?

Also, the "small amount" of SJWs have a lot of power within new media. Gawker Media, for example, consistently promotes an SJW agenda and doesn't even attempt to make it subtle anymore. Their articles influence a ton of people, including other news outlets. That's why I can't read reviews for bluetooth speakers without hearing about women's never ending struggles. Despite all that, there are people who still claim that feminism isn't widely embraced by mainstream culture.

That wasn't a criticism of feminism, but it will be taken as one anyway. There isn't room for commentary unless it's something positive about feminism, or something negative about men. That's why men's issues aren't getting any attention, and that's why the only thing you'll hear about them are the bitter fedora tippers.

(funny clip)

 

[CatParty]

It's obvious where? Even a thread meant to discuss men's issues just turns into people talking about why feminism is good and MRAs are bad. What does feminism have to do with men's issues? How can it help? Why does it need to? The only reason people even bring up men's issues is to bash MRAs and talk about why feminism is good. It's wrong to blame feminism for causing men's issues, but feminism can't help solve them either. Saying feminism can't help hurts feelings because it gets interpreted as an attack against feminism. If it's not directly promoting the feminist agenda, it has to be evil, right?

Also, the "small amount" of SJWs have a lot of power within new media. Gawker Media, for example, consistently promotes an SJW agenda and doesn't even attempt to make it subtle anymore. Their articles influence a ton of people, including other news outlets. That's why I can't read reviews for bluetooth speakers without hearing about women's never ending struggles. Despite all that, there are people who still claim that feminism isn't widely embraced by mainstream culture.

That wasn't a criticism of feminism, but it will be taken as one anyway. There isn't room for commentary unless it's something positive about feminism, or something negative about men. That's why men's issues aren't getting any attention, and that's why the only thing you'll hear about them are the bitter fedora tippers.

(funny clip)
https://youtube.com/watch?v=vBlQt_BsWic

Mras are turds

 

[HG 400]

Mras are turds

Turds are easier to flush.

 

[Marvin]

Despite all that, there are people who still claim that feminism isn't widely embraced by mainstream culture.

At any given point, a reduced standard of equality is accepted by mainstream culture. So, at some point, society might decide that it's not OK for a husband to beat his wife, but it's still wrong for the wife to openly disagree with him on some household issue.

Feminism isn't some fixed standard that we'll achieve one day. We can't say "there, culture finally accepts feminism, all our problems are solved!" It's a process.

Even a thread meant to discuss men's issues just turns into people talking about why feminism is good and MRAs are bad. What does feminism have to do with men's issues? How can it help? Why does it need to? The only reason people even bring up men's issues is to bash MRAs and talk about why feminism is good. It's wrong to blame feminism for causing men's issues, but feminism can't help solve them either.

As far as this relates to men, I do think that feminism essentially solves most discrimination against men too. No serious feminists are proposing things like "hey, let's hand women a bunch of money, that'll make things equal, right?" Because that's silly. A fool and his/her money are easily parted. That money would end back in the hands of the system ASAP.

Rather, feminism works on restructuring the system to make equal treatment as natural as possible. And that inherently makes things more equal for men as well.

Of course, this approach doesn't work perfectly. In particular, problems with this approach will crop up when you start dealing with fundamental biological differences between the sexes. Things like menstruation, pregnancy, (maybe?) rape, etc.

 

[Yog-Spergoth]

I need MRA because...

Equal rights isn't good enough. If They get more rights, I get less, right?

 

[HG 400]

I just want to be able to punch women in the face in public without everyone getting mad at me.

 

[Anustart]

It's obvious where? Even a thread meant to discuss men's issues just turns into people talking about why feminism is good and MRAs are bad. What does feminism have to do with men's issues? How can it help? Why does it need to? The only reason people even bring up men's issues is to bash MRAs and talk about why feminism is good. It's wrong to blame feminism for causing men's issues, but feminism can't help solve them either.

How could it not? Most of the gender-borne problems and prejudices men face are based entirely on the perception of men and women as being opposed to each other in all things which means men have the responsibility to pick up the slack and be robotic he-men in areas of society where women are expected to be weak and useless. It's not hard to see why the destigmatization of women and things tangentially related to them would help men.

Even if this were not the case, the thread is about MRAs. They've created a "movement" that exists solely to have a subtractive effect on another movement and that's feminism so yeah they are pretty closely related concepts.

 

[Datiko]

Pick-Up Artists. Dudes who follow an organised strategy to fuck chicks, which usually relies on dressing like unbearable attentionwhores and then acting mildly insulting towards the chick to play off her insecurities. Feminists hate them fiercely and a small subsect of MRAs (Elliot Rodgers brand, if I remember right) also hate them fiercely. Most people who don't care about dumb politics just see them as sad, attention-craving sluts who never got hugged enough as children, and who now dress up like faggots and bang club-whores to make up for it.

Thanks!

 

[Hummingbird]

It seems that at one time the MRAs had some great ideas, but like feminism, they fell from grace and became a parody of themselves. (It's just the MRAs fell faster.) If they didn't give into hate/bitterness, they could've been a group I would've respected. Maybe it just goes with my boyfriend's theory that the crazier one group gets, there's a good chance the other side will become at least about as nuts to match them.

 

[HG 400]

MRAs are turds.