- Registrado
- 27 de Jun, 2014
They have. It's just really easy to lose amongst all the bastardry.
🎭 Dramacow Gamergate / Depression Quest Shitstorm
- Iniciador del tema José Mourinho
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🇵🇦 Nuestro primer dominio localizado está en español en kiwifarms.pa. Our first localized domain is on Spanish on kiwifarms.pa.
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appaloosa horse
kiwifarms.net
- Registrado
- 11 de Sep, 2014
they doxxed quinn so i wouldnt exactly say they're a non-issue
certainly doesnt seem like it given the whole situation
- Registrado
- 22 de Jul, 2013
Can I get a source? I haven't been following this thread too tightly.
- Registrado
- 9 de Sep, 2013
I'm fairly sure it was mentioned elsewhere in the thread that Quinn doxxed herself during a false flag attempt.
appaloosa horse
kiwifarms.net
- Registrado
- 11 de Sep, 2014
well judging by their irc logs some of them tried
http://wehuntedthemammoth.com/2014/...ers-dirty-tricks-straight-from-their-irc-log/
considering his previous positions and current status i'll assume david futrelle is credible even if he's a little bit biased
http://wehuntedthemammoth.com/2014/...ers-dirty-tricks-straight-from-their-irc-log/
considering his previous positions and current status i'll assume david futrelle is credible even if he's a little bit biased
- Registrado
- 9 de Sep, 2013
Some of this isn't quite adding up. Zoe's ex already dropped dox on 3/5 of the people she cheated with in the post where he called her out, which was the thing that started it all.
I was actually on 4chan's /v/ during PAX and saw no spamming. There was one mega thread talking about #gamergate and it was only re-posted when the previous thread got archived. There was also no talk about impersonating PoCs on twitter. Most of the posters were advising others to contact the advertisers of sites like Kotaku and others who supported Quinn, letting them know that they would no longer buy their products because of their support for unbiased and fake journalism.
appaloosa horse
kiwifarms.net
- Registrado
- 11 de Sep, 2014
well it wouldnt surprise me if some of it didnt add up because this is an absolute clusterfuck chock full of secrets and juicy details that keep coming out every time something happens and at this point it's next to impossible to tell what's actually real and what is phony bullshit
- Registrado
- 9 de Sep, 2013
So...
Why are you here? I mean, if you can't even be bothered to read the backlog of the thread it sounds like you're just not going to contribute anything.
- Registrado
- 12 de Abr, 2014
Wait, so someone expressed their desire to do less than moral things on a chat where literally anyone can post anything anonymously? Stop the presses, this clearly means all of 4chan is rotten!
The reality is that 4chan has all sorts of people. Some of them are shitty. Nobody disputes this, but this is not at all what gamergate is about.
- Registrado
- 10 de Feb, 2013
Zoe Quinn "doxxed" herself (read: gave false info to /v/ to martyr herself) in a half-assed attempt to pull off a false-flag strategy. Too bad she apparently didn't expect people to actually call the supposed "dox" because when people tested the phone numbers they either went to Pizza restaurants or drycleaners.
She was however complicit in the doxxing of one of the leading people of TFYC's charity (a charity aimed at helping female game developers), which lead to the entire charity being compromised and getting shut down before 4chan swooped in and donated tens of thousands of dollars in support of their project.
So for all her talk about people harassing her and being against doxxing she apparently has no issue with being a massive hypocrite and doxxing others to further her own selfish goals (eliminating competition to promote her "charity" that conveniently goes into her personal paypal account)
- Registrado
- 3 de Feb, 2013
Pretty much everything Zoe has done since the release of Depression Quest is relevant because it can give insight into motive. Zoe got some publicity back around April when she claimed wizardchan raided and harassed her. She claimed they doxxed her. We only have Zoe's word on that since nobody saw the actual harassment and the only proof she has is few random posts she screenshotted from wizardchan that only established a few people there didn't much care for her. There was also no evidence she was actually legitimately doxxed. The interesting thing is despite the fact there is nothing to prove she was harassed by wizardchan other than her word (how does a raid leave no trace?) she still got press from it and so did Depression Quest. Nobody cared at the time because the accused aggressors were a group of depressed men on an obscure website.
Then we have TFYC incident. I'd like to point out that while Zoe was leading a crusade against this group she had her own game jam called "Rebel Jam". The website offers an amazing lack of information If you wanted to donate to the game jam then you could do so by donating to a paypal account... which happened to be Zoe Quinn's personal account.
Now we have the Five Guys incident where information is given out by a bitter ex who can actually provide some substantial evidence that Zoe slept with people in the industry who could benefit her and actually did. The interesting thing about the evidence that came later to help solidify the ex's info is it all came from social media websites like twitter and facebook. Nobody needed to be hacked or doxxed to establish something iffy was going on. These people unintentionally confirmed so much information due to their need to list everything they were always doing. Apparently the only time they lacked any transparency was when it came to their careers. The people she slept with had given Depression Quest positive attention. They never disclosed the fact they were close to Zoe Quinn in their articles. Transparency was everywhere except where it should have been.
Let's talk about current doxxing though. Recently one of Zoe's friends doxxed a teenager who happened to be trans because they defended GamerGate (which is accused of being a movement fueled by misogyny) . Zoe retweeted the dox and commented on how funny she thought it was. I'd like to remind you that Zoe tweets about how she's afraid to go home and how she's tried to talk to the police because she was being harassed due her personal information being released. You'd think someone in that position might have a bit more sympathy regarding this, especially when it comes to a minor. People in gamergate quickly pointed out the hypocrisy in what she had done and she quickly deleted it.
People are fucking weird. Especially when it comes to tweeting everything.
Última edición:
- Registrado
- 3 de Feb, 2013
Interesting facts.
Zoe announces on twitter that she had been spying on a single public irc chat room for three weeks. She posts a few screenshots without much context but still look very negatively on the chat as a whole. Says the logs will be coming out when a journalist is willing to accept them. She is applauded for her detective skills.
The people Zoe spied on release the chat logs themselves because they want to show they have nothing to hide and want people to see the full context. They're vilified because it's viewed as "doc dumping". A supposed attempt to overwhelm people by giving them so much information that it's like finding a needle in a haystack when it comes to finding something relevant.
I've been out of the loop for a bit but I don't know if they've determined which person in the irc chat was Zoe (or whoever logged the chat for her). I guess it's hard to determine when it's a public chat that was advertised for anyone to join and people were coming and going all the time.
Zoe announces on twitter that she had been spying on a single public irc chat room for three weeks. She posts a few screenshots without much context but still look very negatively on the chat as a whole. Says the logs will be coming out when a journalist is willing to accept them. She is applauded for her detective skills.
The people Zoe spied on release the chat logs themselves because they want to show they have nothing to hide and want people to see the full context. They're vilified because it's viewed as "doc dumping". A supposed attempt to overwhelm people by giving them so much information that it's like finding a needle in a haystack when it comes to finding something relevant.
I've been out of the loop for a bit but I don't know if they've determined which person in the irc chat was Zoe (or whoever logged the chat for her). I guess it's hard to determine when it's a public chat that was advertised for anyone to join and people were coming and going all the time.
- Registrado
- 10 de Feb, 2013
So Zoe found bad people on the Internet. Shocker.
- Registrado
- 9 de Sep, 2013
Zoe can find bad people in a mirror.
- Registrado
- 12 de Abr, 2014
What I find especially hypocritical about anti gamergate people is how much they claim gamergate to be pro harrassment and how much they're against it. And yet here we have proven cases of Zoe Quinn doxxing people. Along with people like Leigh Alexander, who gleefully brag about abusing their power to destroy people's careers. Apparently, it's only OK when they do it. Even saying something like "all harassment is bad" will generate a massive hatestorm if you so much as dare to suggest both sides do it. It's also pretty ridiculous that they try to portray gamergate as some sort of unhinged conspiracy theory, while simultaneously pretending 4chan is some sort of puppetmaster pulling all the strings on this evil conspiracy against women that none of the participants even know about. They even funded a feminist game jam! How dare they!
ordinarycough
kiwifarms.net
- Registrado
- 21 de Ago, 2014
No matter how much evidence comes out that shows the Indie gaming scene is out for self-preservation at the expense of certain legitimate ideologies, or that key figures in the movement are lining their own pockets and shutting out those within said movements who challenge them etc. etc. it seems clear to me the Depression Quest shitstorm is not a war or a battle or some kind of fight that can be "won."
This is a public relations event.
I was discussing this with a friend who I respect a great deal. He admitted that he knew nothing about the situation, but was "against" anyone questioning Quinn and company. He admitted that he did not care if they were guilty of any questionable shit they've been accused of (or if they had done anything worse). Discussing it was pointless. The image that Quinn and co. have is simply better than that of their opposition.
These are primarily middle-class individuals with a degree in the liberal arts field. They may not be able to talk about engineering, but they can write very persuasively. Certain people may do unethical things, but by no means is anyone stupid. They are much better at image management than those who oppose them. This is in part just the skills a liberal arts education provides you, in part because some of them actually work in PR.
For example: I've been digging Internet Aristocrat's videos about the event and his live streams. He's articulate and thorough in what he talks about. I may not agree with everything he says, but the guy is clearly not an idiot. But, he's an anonymous guy on Youtube who uses an avatar of a guy in a powdered wig. Several years ago, that might not have worked against his favor too strongly. But the internet is a less anonymous place than it used to be. To many, his image alone suggests "anonymous neckbeard crank with an axe to grind." For as smart as IA might be, I don't think he sees this particular problem. The same applies to any other videos of that nature. Double for any image macro. What they're saying is irrelevant because many have checked out at who or what the source is alone.
This is why the narrative on the other side is frequently personalized, they understand that many people judge an argument by the speaker and not what is said (a logical fallacy, but we are all guilty of this in various degrees). The pathos works (that identity politics is a concept that many in this field buy into heavily does not hurt either, obviously). This is why #notyourshield resulted in some anger and frustration, perhaps more than any "expose" video, because it worked against the image that had been presented.
But really it's not just confined to this. Compare a Feminist Frequency video to say... a Honey Badger Radio podcast or article. The former has much higher production values and just has a better sense of how to convey legitimacy than the latter does. Have you seen that "Sarkisian Effect" mock-up poster? With the blood red horror text on a black background? It looks completely abysmal. One side is leagues better at utilizing an appropriate aesthetic than the other. It's all about image management.
I suspect that the image of Quinn and others is not as tarnished as some of the /v/ threads, or this topic, suggest. To those within say this thread or those /v/ threads, sure. Of course they have less respect for a multitude of people across several fields and sites, I do. To those on Quinn's "side" her image is strengthened. And to someone on the outside, as appaloosa horse shows, Quinn is still ultimately the least wrong and it's the other side that's worse. (Another example might be someone a few pages back who described it as "neckbeard benghazi.")
Ultimately I don't think any kind of "victory" will be achieved by either side. Eventually it will just settle down. Anita isn't going to resign in shame. Phil Fish isn't going to jail. 4chan wont get shut down by proud kinfolk activists. Sites like Kotaku will keep operating as they do until a more profitable way comes along. We'll all just be walking away a little more cynical and probably a little more dug in on our respective sides.
This is a public relations event.
I was discussing this with a friend who I respect a great deal. He admitted that he knew nothing about the situation, but was "against" anyone questioning Quinn and company. He admitted that he did not care if they were guilty of any questionable shit they've been accused of (or if they had done anything worse). Discussing it was pointless. The image that Quinn and co. have is simply better than that of their opposition.
These are primarily middle-class individuals with a degree in the liberal arts field. They may not be able to talk about engineering, but they can write very persuasively. Certain people may do unethical things, but by no means is anyone stupid. They are much better at image management than those who oppose them. This is in part just the skills a liberal arts education provides you, in part because some of them actually work in PR.
For example: I've been digging Internet Aristocrat's videos about the event and his live streams. He's articulate and thorough in what he talks about. I may not agree with everything he says, but the guy is clearly not an idiot. But, he's an anonymous guy on Youtube who uses an avatar of a guy in a powdered wig. Several years ago, that might not have worked against his favor too strongly. But the internet is a less anonymous place than it used to be. To many, his image alone suggests "anonymous neckbeard crank with an axe to grind." For as smart as IA might be, I don't think he sees this particular problem. The same applies to any other videos of that nature. Double for any image macro. What they're saying is irrelevant because many have checked out at who or what the source is alone.
This is why the narrative on the other side is frequently personalized, they understand that many people judge an argument by the speaker and not what is said (a logical fallacy, but we are all guilty of this in various degrees). The pathos works (that identity politics is a concept that many in this field buy into heavily does not hurt either, obviously). This is why #notyourshield resulted in some anger and frustration, perhaps more than any "expose" video, because it worked against the image that had been presented.
But really it's not just confined to this. Compare a Feminist Frequency video to say... a Honey Badger Radio podcast or article. The former has much higher production values and just has a better sense of how to convey legitimacy than the latter does. Have you seen that "Sarkisian Effect" mock-up poster? With the blood red horror text on a black background? It looks completely abysmal. One side is leagues better at utilizing an appropriate aesthetic than the other. It's all about image management.
I suspect that the image of Quinn and others is not as tarnished as some of the /v/ threads, or this topic, suggest. To those within say this thread or those /v/ threads, sure. Of course they have less respect for a multitude of people across several fields and sites, I do. To those on Quinn's "side" her image is strengthened. And to someone on the outside, as appaloosa horse shows, Quinn is still ultimately the least wrong and it's the other side that's worse. (Another example might be someone a few pages back who described it as "neckbeard benghazi.")
Ultimately I don't think any kind of "victory" will be achieved by either side. Eventually it will just settle down. Anita isn't going to resign in shame. Phil Fish isn't going to jail. 4chan wont get shut down by proud kinfolk activists. Sites like Kotaku will keep operating as they do until a more profitable way comes along. We'll all just be walking away a little more cynical and probably a little more dug in on our respective sides.
- Registrado
- 15 de Abr, 2014
The same people who vilify Gamergate are also the same people who blindly follow Zoe Quinn. Quinn's fanbase is an angry mob, complete with pitchforks and torches, blindly lashing out at whatever their leader pointed at.
Zoe Quinn doxxed people? Pfft! Well, obviously it serves them right for hating a respectable, hardworking feminist in the indie gaming industry! /SARCASM
- Registrado
- 27 de Jun, 2014
Let's not forget Devin Faraci, the serial asshole who has repeatedly doxxed women that had the gall to speak out against Quinn's behavior, and happens to, shock of all shocks, be working for the exact same PR firm that employs Anita Sarkeesian, who, equally shockingly, has apparently no trouble working directly alongside someone who happens to be directly accosting people in a manner she just-so-happened to publicly decry. This firm also happens to have ties to Maya Kramer, who, certainly in an unrelated coincidence, happened to be Zoe Quinn's partner-in-crime during the TFYC DDoS.
- Registrado
- 3 de Feb, 2013
The sad reality. Truth is secondary when it comes to good branding.
- Registrado
- 27 de Jun, 2014
The internet smells blood in the water. This isn't going to simply die off this time, I think. Zoe Quinn will escape, certainly, but, rather like Pac-Man for Atari 2600 was with the Gaming Crash of '83, she's practically irrelevant in the bigger pile of madness going on all around her. The meat on the bone isn't Quinn, or Kramer, or even Sarkeesian, though all of them by now have long been proven to be disreputable fuckers who speak for feminism about as much as Jace speaks for the military.
The true crux, the true fight, will be centering around IGF, Indiecade, and Indiefund, and in these, the first round of punches to the balls has already happened. Any attempt to spin this is going to fail. Not because it won't get tidied up - there are people making that happen right now, after all - but because the people that matter already know the truth of the matter. The blade has dropped, and Indiecade and IGF's heads are already in the bucket. Think about it. Now that this is public knowledge, do you think any Indie developer worth the hole in a chicken's ass is going to ever take one of these events seriously or look at them as anything other than the massive corrupt cluster-fucks they are from here on out? Do you think anyone is going to look at IndieFund's games again, and not scream to the heavens about possible bias if one wins an award for anything from now on? Do you think any Indie dev looks at this debacle and rubs their fingerless gloved hands in glee going "Oh man, that Depression Quest thing, I have to get in on that noise!"
It's very true that as a rule, the public has a short memory. The Internet, however, never forgets.
Forevermore they will be scrutinized and treated as the public embarassments they are. At best, they'll be able to try to rebrand the IGF and IndieCade. Depending on how quick internet detectives flush out the rats, however, even that might be doomed to failure.
Seeing Phil Fish in handcuffs, however, would be almost erotically cathartic after all his faggotry.
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