Christian theology thread for Christians - Deus homo factus est naturam erante, mundus renovatus est a Christo regnante

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I don't see what's so based about making utopian idealistic declarations which aren't actually true rather than recognizing reality and being pragmatic about it.

I suspect that this is less about it becoming politically "acceptable" to openly oppose abortion and more about it becoming politically safe (not to mention the Church being infiltrated by the KGB). And you will not find any canon, catechism, synod, or otherwise which says that abortion is okay.

I don't, I was just pointing out where I thought it came from.

I guess I'm just more inclined to be lenient on people having extended brainfarts.
Well you're a lot more fair than I initially believed, so I apologize if I seemed a bit brash and rude. I have been arguing with Dyer fanboys elsewhere and it's started to get a wee bit grating. I do want to ask from an Orthodox perspective, because as someone who has had an interest in World War One... why is Tsar Nicholas II a saint in Orthodoxy? I get it, he was gunned down by Bolsheviks, but so were a lot of others who had a lot less fault in bringing down the Russian Empire. I'm not being a smug prick about it, I just genuinely do not get it.
 
Well you're a lot more fair than I initially believed, so I apologize if I seemed a bit brash and rude. I have been arguing with Dyer fanboys elsewhere and it's started to get a wee bit grating. I do want to ask from an Orthodox perspective, because as someone who has had an interest in World War One... why is Tsar Nicholas II a saint in Orthodoxy? I get it, he was gunned down by Bolsheviks, but so were a lot of others who had a lot less fault in bringing down the Russian Empire. I'm not being a smug prick about it, I just genuinely do not get it.
He and his family were very pious, and they accepted their deaths in a Christlike manner. And even if his incompetence somehow made him have "fault in bringing down the Russian Empire", he was trying his best. Also, there was a semi-martyrial aspect to his death, the atheist communists killing the Orthodox monarch had a symbolic meaning beyond its immediate political utility.
 
And they're always in motels, aren't they?

https://youtube.com/watch?v=q_YJRe7yiZYCurious people's thoughts on Langan's take on God here.
I'm an old enough faggot to know who this fat pedostach wearing freak is.
Laging is a massive faggot, self entitled "smert'est white nigger in the world" due to scoring really really high on an IQ test. Issue being is that the test he scored really high was some bullshit mail in yourself test that nobody in their right mind would take seriously.
He's supposedly pretty good at physics and isn't a total retard. Issue being he has absolutely no skin in science and his most prominent intellectual achievement is conning people that he's a genius.
He has some retarded theory out there about proving God through math or some other larp bullshit that he has been peddling along the way. Issue with that is literally nobody gives a fuck. The few scientific reviews you can find about that theory is that it's just semantic philosophy and pretty shit at that. It's also plagiarized as well from some B tier philosopher from decades ago that Ligger apparently read in college or some shit.
With all that in addition to his racist comments and interesting eugenics ideas where smert people like him should be the only ones allowed to procreate, the fat fuck is a massive piece of shit conman white nigger who should be ferociously scorned upon.

TL;DR: Christopher Langan is a fat fuck, massive piece of shit conman white nigger who should be ferociously scorned upon and nothing he says should be considered as anything more than larp bullshit.

One good thing I can give him is for coming out of the woodworks some years back and doing an interview with that gay faggot Michael Knowels who, for a big conservative Catholic "intellectual gentleman", has himself ousted to be a brainlet pussy who almost sucked Lagan's penis throughout the interview with boatloads of glazing and asking softball questions without even a remark about him being a massive fake.
 
He and his family were very pious, and they accepted their deaths in a Christlike manner. And even if his incompetence somehow made him have "fault in bringing down the Russian Empire", he was trying his best. Also, there was a semi-martyrial aspect to his death, the atheist communists killing the Orthodox monarch had a symbolic meaning beyond its immediate political utility.
It is interesting that he's one of the two WW1 leaders elevated by their faith. Karl I of Austria is considered blessed by the Catholics, but that's because he tried to negotiate a peace a year before the war ended, he died in 1925 I believe.
 
Well you're a lot more fair than I initially believed, so I apologize if I seemed a bit brash and rude. I have been arguing with Dyer fanboys elsewhere and it's started to get a wee bit grating. I do want to ask from an Orthodox perspective, because as someone who has had an interest in World War One... why is Tsar Nicholas II a saint in Orthodoxy? I get it, he was gunned down by Bolsheviks, but so were a lot of others who had a lot less fault in bringing down the Russian Empire. I'm not being a smug prick about it, I just genuinely do not get it.
I mean the man's on KiwiFarms. You can ask Tsar Martyr Nicholas II yourself.

In other news: Bishop Gerasim will be the Locum Tenens for the OCA Diocese of the South
 
He and his family were very pious,
And had a literal insane sex cultist in their inner circle who got the Tsar cocaine.
and they accepted their deaths in a Christlike manner.
Says who? The guilt ridden communist murderers?
And even if his incompetence
He literally laughed off people getting stomped to death on his crowning.
The stupid retard even told British press that he'll fuck up the bolsheviks who dare oppose him. Bar that he completely failed at that, the Brits were in disbelief hearing that bullshit from a foreign monarch, while theirs was put on a leash for centuries.
Nick wasn't just incompetent, we was an outright asshole.
somehow made him have "fault in bringing down the Russian Empire", he was trying his best.
So was Lenin and Stalin. In Stalin's case, he did improve the state by a gargantuan scale. Nick got the country into a war that nobody wanted just because he didn't want to be seen as a pussy.
Also, there was a semi-martyrial aspect to his death, the atheist communists killing the Orthodox monarch had a symbolic meaning beyond its immediate political utility.
No there wasn't lol
Fuck with this cope. He was an elitist leader who was close to getting freed and he died as a political prisoner, atheist regime or no. We don't know the full details of how they died and the only one worth consideration for sainthood in your own definition is his daughter Tatiana, who actually did express piety throughout her life. The drug addicted retard asshole is no more a saint than anyone else who died under the regime that he himself had a hand in bringing about due to his extreme retardation even with good advisers trying to help. Fuck him.

And the only reason the Tsar's family are saints is because its typical Orthodox emotional response to something without any proper analysis just to appear as these wheeping dorks for fake piety points.
Funny being that the same Ort branch that elevated the guy to sainthood became a bitch to the communist regime and today promotes the idiotic slaughter of its Ukraine neighbors.
 
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One must repent and believe in Jesus as Lord and Saviour before the day of judgement. On that day, it will be too late. There is no "little review". Jesus will return in glory, and every knee will bow to him, and be judged according to what they have done. As all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, salvation can only be found by calling upon Jesus to cover our transgressions.
Thanks again for these replies. I hope you've been well. I've been thinking/reading more about God/consciousness lately and had some more random thoughts on this.

So, how does the judgement work when one has accepted Christ as their Lord and Savior? Like, we are all sinners and when Jesus returns, he judges us all, believers and non-believers the same. Wait, is the return describing Jesus walking the Earth again or when we die?

A believer recognizes that Jesus died for our sins.* He accepts Him as his Savior, because otherwise without him, he's in hell. Because hell is the absence of God. Dark, disorderly, without purpose, absence of light, etc.

Thus, he is saved because he has laid his sins on the cross and is washed clean with the blood of Christ. Is part of repentence living in a WWJD way? Because God is perfect, just, truth, light, goodness, etc., we strive to be these things to become closer to Him.

But we are wicked and live in rebellion to Him. We don't really deserve His grace and have amassed a debt that we can never repay. Even living a very nice and decent life isn't enough because no person is without sin. And becoming one with God again can't happen if you're imperfect, like a square peg into a round hole. So Christ takes all of that sin off you so when you die, you can rejoin God?

So on your day of judgment, which is aftet dying, Jesus reviews your transgressions, regardless of whether he has saved you or not? During this, you'd recognize how you truly don't deserve His mercy due to your sinfiul nature (and likely be blown away in the presence of the Lord, magnifying just how much you really don't deserve His Grace).

But because you have already accepted that He did this for you, He still lets you rejoin Him? Or do you just skip past the transgression review like Jesus is a club bouncer at the pearly Gates letting the homies through without a pat down? Seems more meaningful if the former. I would hope so.

What if you never attempted to be less sinful after the acceptance? Is that even possible with true acceptance that Jesus died for us?

Ok, so nothing can change anything at the review point for non-believers. Not because God is vengeful or doesn't love us, but because we are the ones who rejected Him. And recognizing Him as our Savior in His Glory now doesn't count because it would essentially be forced? God doesn't want a relationship by force, which is why He gave us free will to choose?

So even if we beg and plead and admit we were sinful, nothing can change now. Not because God wants us to be without Him, but because we have already chosen to disassociate with him by rejecting his love and the mercy he already showed us on the cross. And any desire for a relationship with Jesus in this moment wouldn't be genuine, it would be pure selfishness and forced because God revealed himself to you. He essentially removed your free will at that point.

Sorry for how rambling this is. I am sure there are many parts I am misunderstanding and would appreciate where I go wrong.

* So many bits of Christianity are such ubiquitous fixtures in our country that I feel it's detrimental for a largely secular person. Like, you develop an understanding of the terms and phrases when young, but without any connection to/understanding of their meaning. God's Triunal nature is extremely confusing and obviously not something humans can relate to.

I never understood what Him dying for our sins meant or why it mattered, though knew the phrasing. It just sounded to me like this dude came down and died because we suck. Like he died just because of our sins, not also for them (which was essentially buying our debt we can't repay). It also makes it sound like we're all good regardless of recognition of it, which seems dangerous. Maybe that's why spreading the Gospel is important, haha.
 
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Praise Christ our Lord.

I appreciate having been temporarily banned from this thread a short while back. I was attempting to entail the skepticism regarding the historicity of practically any literalist approach as to the conceivability regarding whether biblical history was even at all real. Whether Christ "happened"; whether the Holy Ghost can be appreciated through anxious meditation lenient enough as to try reaching out toward deriving purpose from the stupidity of mythicism.

Well, I hope I didn't gauge eyes out by just seeming like I'm eating it all up (if anybody cares to go back and recall).

It gave me time to not just ponder, but trust that my faith has stood the test of time, however unutterable it is sometimes even in passage.

In Jesus Christ we trust,
Amen.
 
So, how does the judgement work when one has accepted Christ as their Lord and Savior? Like, we are all sinners and when Jesus returns, he judges us all, believers and non-believers the same. Wait, is the return describing Jesus walking the Earth again or when we die?
It's probably a bit of both. There's some sort of temporary state between now and the Resurrection of the Dead. The Bible doesn't say much about it, except that we'll be with Christ and it will be far better than this. What happens to the unrepentant during that time? It's not clear.

A believer recognizes that Jesus died for our sins.* He accepts Him as his Savior, because otherwise without him, he's in hell. Because hell is the absence of God. Dark, disorderly, without purpose, absence of light, etc.

Thus, he is saved because he has laid his sins on the cross and is washed clean with the blood of Christ. Is part of repentence living in a WWJD way? Because God is perfect, just, truth, light, goodness, etc., we strive to be these things to become closer to Him.

But we are wicked and live in rebellion to Him. We don't really deserve His grace and have amassed a debt that we can never repay. Even living a very nice and decent life isn't enough because no person is without sin. And becoming one with God again can't happen if you're imperfect, like a square peg into a round hole. So Christ takes all of that sin off you so when you die, you can rejoin God?
I wouldn't emphasize sin as a debt, though God's grace is absolutely a free and undeserved gift. In all discussions of atonement, it's surprisingly rare to see the words of the Man himself.

"... just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.” - Matthew 20:28

This is right after a discussion on the nature of rulership. This is the ransom theory. It's rather fallen out of favor, and that's a tragedy. In a cosmic exchange, Jesus took the bullet for us. Not the wrath of God, but destructive powers of darkness, human and non-human, that held us in their thrall. God paid this ransom to the powers of evil, not because he owed it to them, but out of overwhelming love for his fallen creation. He took the sin of the world onto him, and exhausted it.

In doing this, he recreated the bridge between God and fallen man, so that we could rejoin that communion, imperfectly in this life, but eventually in full.

So on your day of judgment, which is aftet dying, Jesus reviews your transgressions, regardless of whether he has saved you or not? During this, you'd recognize how you truly don't deserve His mercy due to your sinfiul nature (and likely be blown away in the presence of the Lord, magnifying just how much you really don't deserve His Grace).

But because you have already accepted that He did this for you, He still lets you rejoin Him? Or do you just skip past the transgression review like Jesus is a club bouncer at the pearly Gates letting the homies through without a pat down? Seems more meaningful if the former. I would hope so.

What if you never attempted to be less sinful after the acceptance? Is that even possible with true acceptance that Jesus died for us?
It's hard to say for sure if we have to sit down with our sins on Judgement Day, but there are some Biblical hints that this is probably the case. I also find it interesting, though not definitive, that life reviews are a near universal feature of near death experiences.

But your logic is why I've slowly come to believe in something like purgatory. Not exactly the way the Catholics would articulate it, but if we die in sin (and we do), something has to happen so the unfiltered light of God doesn't simply vaporize us. That would mean we have to be not just forgiven of our sin (God has already done this), but be made clean so we don't sin any more. Maybe that's burned out of us in a single, terrifying instant, but I tend to think it's a more gradual process. Something like the Great Divorce. I suspect that may also be what happens if repentance has been half-hearted, it's just a much harder process.

Ok, so nothing can change anything at the review point for non-believers. Not because God is vengeful or doesn't love us, but because we are the ones who rejected Him. And recognizing Him as our Savior in His Glory now doesn't count because it would essentially be forced? God doesn't want a relationship by force, which is why He gave us free will to choose?

So even if we beg and plead and admit we were sinful, nothing can change now. Not because God wants us to be without Him, but because we have already chosen to disassociate with him by rejecting his love and the mercy he already showed us on the cross. And any desire for a relationship with Jesus in this moment wouldn't be genuine, it would be pure selfishness and forced because God revealed himself to you. He essentially removed your free will at that point.
This has been the general conensus, but I am a heretic on this point. I don't think death is necessarily the end of the possibility for redemption. It's possible that some people have so completely, thoroughly shut God out by their own actions, they've made themselves unable to ask for forgiveness. I'm not convinced that's true, but it's possible.

However, for the rest of us... why DO we think that death is the end of God's love for the sinner? If this is the God who dies for his creation, the God who leaves behind 99 sheep to find even a single one of the lost, how can we put a limit on his mercy? Whe Paul said that nothing can seprate us from the love of God, he included death in that. Does God only love those who believe in him? Or did he die for every laast human, including sinners?

There is some Biblical basis for this, called the Harrowing of Hell. Catholics add some extra tradition to it, but the core event is Biblical. After his death, Jesus descended into the earth to preach the Gospel to the captives there. It's debated whether that only refers to the righteous dead like Abraham and Moses, but 1 Peter specifically mentions disobedient spirits.

So I have to ask: Are we so sure this only happened once? What if the Good Shepard seeks out his lost sheep every day until the Judgment, or even beyond that?

So many bits of Christianity are such ubiquitous fixtures in our country that I feel it's detrimental for a largely secular person. Like, you develop an understanding of the terms and phrases when young, but without any connection to/understanding of their meaning. God's Triunal nature is extremely confusing and obviously not something humans can relate to.
While I don't think it's wise for a Christian to deny the Trinity, I suspect God cuts us puny humans some slack on fully understanding this one.

I never understood what Him dying for our sins meant or why it mattered, though knew the phrasing. It just sounded to me like this dude came down and died because we suck. Like he died just because of our sins, not also for them (which was essentially buying our debt we can't repay). It also makes it sound like we're all good regardless of recognition of it, which seems dangerous. Maybe that's why spreading the Gospel is important, haha.
Atonement is hotly debated. Always has been. There are a lot of theories, but I still go with ransom, because that's what Jesus himself said about the topic. The powers of darkness held humanity and all creation hostage, and Jesus offered himself in exchange to set us free.

While there's a possibilty of redemption even in the next life, it's still vitally important in this one. The Christian message isn't about escape into the afterlife, it's that God has come back in person to rescue his creation. God tasks us to begin working toward that now, in this life, and let his will be done on earth as in heaven.
 
I wouldn't emphasize sin as a debt, though God's grace is absolutely a free and undeserved gift. In all discussions of atonement, it's surprisingly rare to see the words of the Man himself.
Agreed. I mentioned it as debt you can't repay to stress that it's just not something we can ever "fix," but admittedly don't have a better term. Perhaps ransom.

I kind of liken it to needing to be perfect, but we can't be. Ever. Like it would throw the balance off of God and defy His own logical function, hence our need to be purified by Christ first. But this is just how I see things in my head to make sense of it, it's not based on anything I've read since I haven't read much.
I also find it interesting, though not definitive, that life reviews are a near universal feature of near death experiences.
Same! Since I was a really young kid, before I thought much about the afterlife, I always just assume that was a real thing. I used to call it my "life movie" and I would all my good moments, including bad, people I hurt, etc. Just the full curtain reveal. I didn't know they were such a staple in NDEs.
Whe Paul said that nothing can seprate us from the love of God, he included death in that. Does God only love those who believe in him? Or did he die for every laast human, including sinners?
If God is all there is, I think even if we were in hell, we would be a part of him in some way, right? But I agree with you, or at least I hope we are correct in that God wouldn't give up on us. I feel like it might just be harder to get back to him if we are shutting him out. But I also think God can see what's in our hearts and doesn't want to give up on us.

Maybe we just respawn down here, which is the purgatory, until we make it clear we want to rejoin him.
So I have to ask: Are we so sure this only happened once? What if the Good Shepard seeks out his lost sheep every day until the Judgment, or even beyond that?
I sure hope so. If God is there, I don't want to reject him. At the very least, Jesus was a really rad dude you'd want as a neighbor. I like how Christianity's God in fleshy form is just an all-around awesome dude.

I heard the tale of Jesus and the adulteress was apocryphal and added later, but I like it. It's a good lesson. I also heard the missing body in the tomb was also apocryphal, but didn't Christ appear to some of the disciples after? And they were executed while still maintaining Christ had come to them.
The powers of darkness held humanity and all creation hostage, and Jesus offered himself in exchange to set us free.
Hmm, interesting. I will have to read more about the ransom theory. That sounds like Archons or Demiurge stuff or something.

Are the powers of darkness spiritual or our own creation, like simply referring to us as fallen and needing to be saved?
While there's a possibilty of redemption even in the next life, it's still vitally important in this one. The Christian message isn't about escape into the afterlife, it's that God has come back in person to rescue his creation. God tasks us to begin working toward that now, in this life, and let his will be done on earth as in heaven.
I wonder if it's like some tipping point thing. After the flood, God promised to not do that again or what? Because I feel like as an American, we aren't giving him many reasons not to nuke the joint. When a nation can't defend it's women (a woman is whoever she says she is), and they don't defend the weakest, most innocent among us (just a "clump of cells"), and we aren't even defending our borders (no human is illegal, except the unborn, I guess), it's like damn, that seems to be a total rejection of Him.

In the beginning was the Word, but we aren't even defending our language from being corrupted to the point we can't even communicate reality. God is the ultimate reality without the buffer. How can the master architect send himself down in God mode again? If we didn't murder him in the womb, he'd just get run over by some jeet in a dump truck who can't read traffic signs. Or be born to two homos who rip him from the surrogate and rape him to death. It's bad.

Thanks for the responses. A Lutheran Church by my house leaves water bottles in coolers with ice out for people. It's very kind of them. Most Christians seem to be very decent, humble folk. I don't like seeing so many lies about them, lies about the Gospel, and their churches perverted.

I think Bryce added some details that aren't totally accurate, but the main point still comes off: Christ was flesh and was severely and brutally beaten, eventually dying an agonizing death. I like his conviction about how for the longest time he didn't know Him, but now he does and nothing is the same.
 
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