Attack on Titan Griefing Thread - >tfw even your VA thinks that you're a loser

[Bunny Tracks]

It's the 'cycle of violence' story but written for retards.

It's a cycle of violence story, but written by a guy who lives in a country that proves it can be broken within less than the amount of time thought possible in-series.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

He ditched his friends on the spying mission to go rogue only to send them cryptic letters saying "if you don't show up on this day I'm going in alone."

They wouldn't do it otherwise, right?

This act gets several friends and allies killed

Welcome to war.

has him attacking both a mixture of hard and soft targets, something that would likely be considered a war crime

Who cares? The ends justify the means.

and doesn't care in the slightest about his companions.

If that was true he'd not have concocted his retarded plan for their sake.

He and the Jaegarists conspire and turn the vast majority of the Paradisian military into Titans, attempt to kill Levi, and threatens his old crew with death when they say it's wrong.

And he did that because the alternative is being genocided. The only viable alternative was Zeke's plan, it's not as good as just doing the Rumbling, but it's better than hoping for peace.

his friends were in negotiations

Doesn't matter. We know Paradis is wiped out after the world recovered from the Rumbling, which bought his friends enough time to at least live their lives (RIP to their family & friends). Eren's plan even framed them as selfless heroes who betrayed their own best interests for the sake of the world, and still they were wiped out.

Negotiations were NEVER a valid option. Since Paradis was destroyed even under the most favorable circumstances then there was never a chance before either. This is called logic, try it some time.

There was the partial Rumbling that was discussed

Which is what ended up happening. How'd that go? Oh, right...

It is not a suicide pact.

It objectively was. I didn't even need the ending to spell it out for me. If we never got that final chapter I'd still assume Paradis eventually got wiped out, but we did get it, and yet you and a few other retards still somehow think peace was viable. Like holy shit, does Isayama need to say those exact words to you?

If there was a super Jew that could murder every German, wouldn't it prove the Germans correct? That they needed to systematically execute us for their own safety?

From their own perspective maybe, but that doesn't change that the Super Jew powers exist, and so if the Jews want to avert the Holocaust they need that. There is no talking your way out of the Holocaust, you need power or to just beg for mercy which will not come (and didn't come, as we know).

Violence begets more violence, and at *every* juncture taking a chance at communicating prevents something in the microcosm.

That's so painfully naive. I sometimes worry what'll happen if traitors infiltrate our government and military, but ever since arguing with AoT fans about this I now also worry about pacifists, that's probably an even bigger, more realistic threat. It's hard to believe such idealistic babble is serious.

Israel will never be at peace so long as Muslims exist anywhere nearby. Luckily for Israel, they're not helpless and don't have the whole world against them, or they'd already be dead before their begging lips could part.

Peace through power is the only option, why do you think America sends Israel war funds instead of counselors to talk their problems out? I'm sure the Islamic terrorists would listen if only they tried sucking their cocks juuust right.

They could've just shot Eren at the beginning instead of hearing Armin out.

They couldn't have because Eren was manipulating events.

The island people instead of rumbling their enemies to extinction decide to leave enough of them alive so that they can rebuild, and return in the future, and commit genocide on the inhabitants of the island with even more advanced war machines like stealth bombers.

But hey, at least they didn't stoop to their enemies' level!

It's a cycle of violence story, but written by a guy who lives in a country that proves it can be broken within less than the amount of time thought possible in-series.

How so?

 

[Bunny Tracks]

How so?

America and Japan went from trying to kill each other to being the closest of allies in the span of less than 50 years.

 

[R00T]

@SSj_Ness (Yiffed) You're assuming negotiation wouldn't work outright with no attempt even being made. Eren didn't allow it to happen. You're also assuming that the Rumbling will work, something extremely retarded to do.

1. The Rumbling is completely theoretical up until the moment it happens. It's revealed through several sources that claim it will work, but no one has never seen it. It's putting all of your eggs into a potential basket.

2. There is no proof that the Rumbling will work as intended. It's implied heavily that Ymir has more of a sway over Eren than you might think. What's to say she doesn't trample the world then march the titans back to destroy Paradis as well, after all it was Fritz and his people that abused her the worst. Why shouldn't she trample everything. It's perfectly reasonable as on the way off the island the Titans trampled Paradisians without prejudice.

I'm sorry it wasn't a pro-genocide murder fantasy story in the end.

 

[DrearyDoomguy]

Which is what ended up happening. How'd that go? Oh, right...

Didn't something like 90% of the world end up getting annihilated? I guess technically that's partial. The idea, I assume, would be to have them all march in a relatively narrow column formation that's wide enough to take out the intended targets while only taking out 10% of the world rather than 90%.
It would have been interesting to see them at least try such a thing only for them to completely lose control of it. Something about the mental strain of controlling thousands of titans at once causing Eren to completely lose his sense of self and enter some sort of dissociative state that results in the full rumbling taking place. Would have made much more sense than him going straight to the kill 'em all option.

 

[TheHarbinger]

Didn't something like 90% of the world end up getting annihilated?

We don't really know what happened as the author didn't explain anything. A 'real' rumbling would kill off every bit of life on Earth most likely. The oceans would boil over losing all fish and plants. The air would be toxic making breathing impossible. The dust clouds would kill all plants and block out the sun as well. Nothing would grow and everyone and everything would starve.

It's just plot magic that Eren can rumble part of the planet without wiping everyone out.

 

[R00T]

Didn't something like 90% of the world end up getting annihilated? I guess technically that's partial. The idea, I assume, would be to have them all march in a relatively narrow column formation that's wide enough to take out the intended targets while only taking out 10% of the world rather than 90%.

The idea of partial rumbling they threw around involved only waking up a portion of the wall (they theorized the wall surrounding Shiganshina would've sufficed) and have it march at the Kingdom of Marley. The idea would be to tell the rest of the world that this is the power they wield and they do not wish to do it again.

Once again to reiterate: outside of the Japanese people they didn't talk to a single nation, most of which had severe issues with Marley due to them abusing the power of the Titans. It's a silly argument to make that gambling on the rumbling working to perfection would be the better solution than attempting reason.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

America and Japan went from trying to kill each other to being the closest of allies in the span of less than 50 years.

The differences in circumstances is so astounding and numerous that it feels inadequate to merely point out that it's a false equivalence, even accounting for the fantasy elements.

Japan was not hated & feared to the degree Paradis is, we could've nuked their island into Chernobyl but we didn't, we accepted their unconditional surrender, but the closest equivalent Paradis could get was sterilization.

You're assuming negotiation wouldn't work outright with no attempt even being made.

You can maybe argue that from everyone but the readers' or Eren's point of view, even though it's still very naive. However, you cannot deny the reality that there was nothing they could do that would prove they're peaceful and not devil's--AGAIN, they betrayed Paradis and killed their trump card to save their enemies, putting themselves at their enemies' mercy, and yet were still destroyed despite being world heroes after the world rebuilt.

What more could they POSSIBLY have done? You tell me.

The Rumbling is completely theoretical up until the moment it happens.

What? No it isn't. Everyone important knows it's real, especially Eren. Didn't it also happen in the past? I don't know where you're getting this from.

Besides, it's their only option. Yapping got them killed, that's a canonical fact.

There is no proof that the Rumbling will work as intended. It's implied heavily that Ymir has more of a sway over Eren than you might think.

This is true, but I don't think anybody knew that she even existed until they fought her, aside from Eren and Zeke, let alone her impact.

I also think that's the most overlooked retarded plot point. There are lots of stupid things packed into the back half of AoT people criticize, but Ymir having influence over Eren not only sucks from a story perspective but also simply undermines the theme of freedom Isayama jammed down our throats.

I'm sorry it wasn't a pro-genocide murder pro-self-defense patriotic fantasy story in the end.

Me too bro, me too.

Didn't something like 90% of the world end up getting annihilated? I guess technically that's partial. The idea, I assume, would be to have them all march in a relatively narrow column formation that's wide enough to take out the intended targets while only taking out 10% of the world rather than 90%.

Oh, so they definitely wouldn't still wipe out Paradis if it was only 10%, right? The only difference there would be how fast they rebuild and wipe out the devils.

It would have been interesting to see them at least try such a thing only for them to completely lose control of it. Something about the mental strain of controlling thousands of titans at once causing Eren to completely lose his sense of self and enter some sort of dissociative state that results in the full rumbling taking place. Would have made much more sense than him going straight to the kill 'em all option.

It'd make even less military sense, but it would've at least been more interesting than what we did get.

The idea of partial rumbling they threw around involved only waking up a portion of the wall (they theorized the wall surrounding Shiganshina would've sufficed) and have it march at the Kingdom of Marley. The idea would be to tell the rest of the world that this is the power they wield and they do not wish to do it again.

Except they wouldn't be able to "do it again" even if they wanted to if they lost the Founding Titan (they would and nearly did several times). Furthermore, even if they could indefinitely secure him (impossible) there is no guarantee the next Founding Titan would have the will to fight like Eren did, he might just be a pacifist who chooses to embrace Paradis' annihilation like Eren's predecessor.

Plus if I remember correctly, technological advancements were getting to the point where soon they'd render Titans obsolete, so it was a "now or never" kind of situation. No matter how you cut it, Paradis had to do the Rumbling and to completion or they'd be destroyed eventually, as we know without question. Why are we debating this?

 

[DrearyDoomguy]

You can maybe argue that from everyone but the readers' or Eren's point of view, even though it's still very naive. However, you cannot deny the reality that there was nothing they could do that would prove they're peaceful and not devil's--AGAIN, they betrayed Paradis and killed their trump card to save their enemies, putting themselves at their enemies' mercy, and yet were still destroyed despite being world heroes after the world rebuilt.

Given the state the rest of the world after the conclusion of the series the war could just as easily have been over the world's dwindling resources. The one place virtually untouched with abundant natural resources would naturally be a target given how badly the rest of the world would be faring even after decades of recovery - assuming recovery would even be possible. Again, the long term prospects of the world recovering after having 90% of its biosphere destroyed were never made clear.

 

[Quiet Guy]

What more could they POSSIBLY have done? You tell me.

Not killing off 80% of the population? I'd imagine that would lead people to be less murderous. Still, simply killing Eren without causing major damage would be risky. With that said, I'd argue that causing massive damage, while getting rid of their defenses is one of the dumbest things he could do.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

Given the state the rest of the world after the conclusion of the series the war could just as easily have been over the world's dwindling resources.

There's zero indication of that, it's frankly disingenuous, but even if I were to entertain such desperate argument, uh... Paradis is literally just a relatively small island nation. You're telling me its enemies are so hard up for resources (despite being sonehow militarily superior, so, no) that they need to completely wipe out the civilization on this island? Doesn't make sense or ring true in the least, and that's putting aside the obvious truth that they weren't randomly destroyed for resources, that wasn't the intent of the chapter and you know it.

Is it really so hard to just acknowledge that peace isn't always an option that you need mental gymnastics to avoid that conclusion? How many civilizations were conquered and destroyed for LESS reason throughout history in the real world than to get revenge on monster people? Fuck dude

The one place virtually untouched with abundant natural resources would naturally be a target given how badly the rest of the world would be faring even after decades of recovery - assuming recovery would even be possible. Again, the long term prospects of the world recovering after having 90% of its biosphere destroyed were never made clear.

You have people insisting the world would be destroyed if the Rumbling happened as it did, including Paradis (which obviously isn't true in the story even if it'd be true irl), and yet it wasn't. We can't apply real world theories to fiction so strictly, the air wasn't depicted as anything but clear and clean after the Rumbling was over, the oceans anything but normal, the land only superficially damaged as far as we know.

They even show rebuilding efforts to mitigate damage like planting trees, so the only thing you can assume based on what's shown and told is things are more or less fine from an ecological perspective. In the end, there's no evidence to the contrary, it's never mentioned at all as a possibility by anyone before the Rumbling nor as a consequence of its enactment (to my memory). An ecological apocalypse was a non-issue fans headcanon'd and theorized up, whether it makes sense or not.

Not killing off 80% of the population? I'd imagine that would lead people to be less murderous.

Think so? Killing off 0% of the population and living isolated in peace, ignorant that the rest of the world even fucking existed was enough to bring absolute genocide upon them, so they seemed maximally murderous already, wouldn't you say?

Really, are you fucking serious? If 0% = unprovoked genocide, what will 10% do...? 80% also resulted in their genocide. Yeah, I'm sure there's a goldilocks percentage between 0% (get genocided) and 80% (get genocided) where everybody would be cool with the result and just leave Paradis in peace. 10% is the magic answer, you cracked the code!

100% (or close to it, so they can never rebuild or take so long to do so their history is lost) is the don't-get-genocided percentage, period. There's no logical argument otherwise given the facts and circumstances. Isayama wrote Paradis into a corner, you don't have to like that, I don't either because it leaves virtually zero room for discussion about what should've happened instead, it's boring. Well, it should leave no room for discussion, but we still have unreasonable pacifism and blind faith in peace talks to rely on to keep debate going, apparently.

 

[DrearyDoomguy]

There's zero indication of that

We're shown what the land looks like after getting trampled.

it's frankly disingenuous, but even if I were to entertain such desperate argument

"Desperate"? Really? I'm just pointing out something that makes sense to me. If I were to be proven wrong it'd be no skin off my back.

uh... Paradis is literally just a relatively small island nation.

When you want more resources are you going to overlook a place that has them?

Doesn't make sense or ring true in the least, and that's putting aside the obvious truth that they weren't randomly destroyed for resources, that wasn't the intent of the chapter and you know it.

The takeaway for me was that there was always going to be war and conflict. So yes, it does make sense.

You're telling me its enemies are so hard up for resources (despite being sonehow militarily superior, so, no) that they need to completely wipe out the civilization on this island?

Who says they were wiping out civilization? All we saw was the city being bombed, meaning they were at war with the outside world.

You have people insisting the world would be destroyed if the Rumbling happened as it did, including Paradis (which obviously isn't true in the story even if it'd be true irl), and yet it wasn't. We can't apply real world theories to fiction so strictly, the air wasn't depicted as anything but clear and clean after the Rumbling was over, the oceans anything but normal, the land only superficially damaged as far as we know.

The land was literally flattened to a barren wasteland. Looked to me like everything was absolutely fucked. If you can speculate on how hypothetical negotiations might have ended up I can speculate on the long term ramifications of destroying most of the world's plant and animal life.

They even show rebuilding efforts to mitigate damage like planting trees, so the only thing you can assume based on what's shown and told is things are more or less fine from an ecological perspective.

The only thing we're shown in the manga is the island being fine. I have no idea about the anime because I didn't watch it and don't really care enough to change that.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

We're shown what the land looks like after getting trampled.

And what indicates it's entirely and permanently rendered uninhabitable? They wouldn't waste their time, effort, and resources with rebuilding efforts if that was the case. As far as the story is concerned the damage was temporary and minimal in the grand scheme of things aside from the loss of human life. There is absolutely no mention of animals all going extinct and land being rendered worthless on a large enough scale that the remaining humans cannot reasonably live. Again, they rebuilt well enough to overtake Paradis so they can't be that needy.

When you want more resources are you going to overlook a place that has them?

No, but you're starting with the assumption that they need resources badly enough to go to war for them but also overlooking that they're somehow thriving well enough to take out Paradis, which which itself was doing just fine, especially in the more distant, sci-fi future of the anime. Doesn't look like either side was hurting for resources, especially to the degree that all-out annihilation is required.

The takeaway for me was that there was always going to be war and conflict. So yes, it does make sense.

That vague notion does, not the resource theory.

Who says they were wiping out civilization? All we saw was the city being bombed, meaning they were at war with the outside world.

That's obtuse. You're willing to assume based on literally nothing that the world is uninhabitable due to the Rumbling. You're willing to assume based on nothing that the war was due to resources. But for you it's a step too far to think it was more than one city wiped out just because it wasn't directly shown or stated otherwise?

The message was clear dude. What Eren said was true, he could buy them time but it's up to them after that, but they failed. And now he's Eren's a bird. ...And a tree. And in the afterlife with Mikasa... They really should've just picked one lol

The land was literally flattened to a barren wasteland.

Since you won't believe that it was more than one city destroyed because it wasn't shown or stated, then you can't say all of the land was in that condition, just the land they showed. Who knows the extent of the damage elsewhere, maybe it was just particularly bad in that area, right?

If you can speculate on how hypothetical negotiations might have ended up

We don't need to speculate. Unless we come up with some new headcanon reason for why Paradis would be attacked--like resource wars, or fighting over which of those Evangelion anime waifus is better, or whether pineapple belongs on pizza--then we already know that there was never a chance at peace.

The only thing we're shown in the manga is the island being fine. I have no idea about the anime because I didn't watch it and don't really care enough to change that.

I don't remember if it was anime only or not, it might've been a special chapter or something like that which depicted it.

Anyway, there's not much different about the anime so you can safely skip it. The most significant differences (at least to the ending) are some dialogue tweaks, how much further in the future the attack on Paradis occurs, and Eren reuniting with Mikasa in the afterlife. Oh, and some new scene in a compilation film, but I don't think it's canon, it's some kind of meta/alternate universe thing or whatever.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

It's been months and you may think AOT is dead but it still lives both officially and with fan-made cringe

Also the final final season is getting its own movie with the School caste ending coming next month which will be in theaters.

REQUIEM CHAPTER 1 IS GETTING ANIMATED JANUARY 15TH

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

Was was Requiem again? The extra Levi chapter that released or something?

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Was was Requiem again? The extra Levi chapter that released or something?

Fan project that tried to "fix" the ending of AOT from chapter 137 forward.

It is cringe as it has MCU level dialogue, is an tryhard level of edge, and does its best to pander to the Eren x Historia side of the fandom. Literally the only thing it has going for it is having good art.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

Fan project that tried to "fix" the ending of AOT from chapter 137 forward.

It is cringe as it has MCU level dialogue, is an tryhard level of edge, and does its best to pander to the Eren x Historia side of the fandom. Literally the only thing it has going for it is having good art.

Shipping is always dumb unless it's an obviously canon romance, Eren and Historia were only friends. I can't remember, I think maybe there was some mention of her bearing his offspring but it was considered for some kind of scheme or something. Or I'm just talking out my ass. I know they didn't really have any chemistry anyway.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Shipping is always dumb unless it's an obviously canon romance, Eren and Historia were only friends. I can't remember, I think maybe there was some mention of her bearing his offspring but it was considered for some kind of scheme or something. Or I'm just talking out my ass. I know they didn't really have any chemistry anyway.

The whole offspring thing was just an unintentional mystery Isayama created since he played it straight forward that Historia got hitched with some random farmer and didn't think people would question if it was an established character, especially when Historia was such a major character in one of the previous important arcs.

But yeah Eren and Historia were only friends pretty much, and the one scene where they interacted in the later part of the series was him pretty much blackmailing her to follow his plans, yet shippers found it romantic.

 

[Trollblade69]

Whether their relationship was romantic or just friendly, it's probably this show's greatest failing that Historia got functionally thrown out of the manga after the Uprising arc. Also doesn't help that Ymir gets killed off offscreen and her Titan goes to a placeholder in Porco Galliard.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

The whole offspring thing was just an unintentional mystery Isayama created since he played it straight forward that Historia got hitched with some random farmer and didn't think people would question if it was an established character, especially when Historia was such a major character in one of the previous important arcs.

There was no story hint intentionally mentioned or implied? I see, I guess I'm just misremembering then. I thought they planned to pass on the special Titan power or something.

But yeah Eren and Historia were only friends pretty much, and the one scene where they interacted in the later part of the series was him pretty much blackmailing her to follow his plans, yet shippers found it romantic.

This debate I remember having with someone else. There wasn't any romance but there wasn't blackmail either. I think people just read into things with a certain lense, especially when it comes to Eren because he's terrible divisive.

Whether their relationship was romantic or just friendly, it's probably this show's greatest failing that Historia got functionally thrown out of the manga after the Uprising arc. Also doesn't help that Ymir gets killed off offscreen and her Titan goes to a placeholder in Porco Galliard.

Historia got treated worse than humans did in DBZ, she barely existed. Ymir being killed off-screen is okay, it was pretty much known, iirc, that she was going to her death, it doesn't necessarily need to be shown.