Opinion America Has Decided It Went Overboard on Covid-19 - No shit Sherlock!

America Has Decided It Went Overboard on Covid-19
The New York Times (archive.ph)
By David Wallace-Wells
2023-03-18 01:23:26GMT

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Ibrahim Rayintakath

In both the United States and Britain, there is suddenly a front-and-center debate about the very earliest days of the pandemic and how each country responded. Did mitigation measures imposed in the spring of 2020, amid great anxiety and uncertainty, actually work? And considering the costs, were they worth it?

In the United States, that conversation was precipitated by a Department of Energy leak about Covid-19’s origins and by a flood of hearings initiated by the Republican House majority into those origins and the American response: the impacts of shelter-in-place guidance and school closures, vaccine development and mask guidance, and more. In Britain, it was precipitated by a leak of more than 100,000 ready-for-the-tabloids WhatsApp messages between Matt Hancock, the secretary of state for health and social care for the first 15 months of the pandemic, and other senior figures of the British government, including Prime Minister Boris Johnson, who at one point, misreading the number of decimal places in a fatality-rate estimate, appeared to conclude that Covid was only 1/100th as deadly as it was. “If you are over 65 your risk of dying from Covid is probably as big as your risk of falling down stairs,” Johnson wrote to his team in August 2020. “And we don’t stop older people from using stairs. What do you think?”

It’s telling that the British scandal centers on Hancock, who reached the highest levels of public notoriety when he was caught disobeying his own social-distancing orders to visit his aide with whom he was having an extramarital affair. It’s also telling that the scandal has come about because the ghostwriter Hancock hired to help him cash in on that infamy, herself apparently a lockdown skeptic, eventually turned on him and, shortly after the book’s publication, sent the messages to The Daily Telegraph. That’s because, for much of the pandemic in England, the country’s leaders came under fire for incompetence to some degree but especially for their hypocrisy. (Johnson’s own top adviser Dominic Cummings kept memorably comparing him to an out-of-control shopping cart, but he was forced to ultimately resign over fallout from parties held during periods of social distancing.)

By contrast, to the extent Americans vilified their leaders over the course of the pandemic, it was not primarily for hypocrisy (remember Gavin Newsom’s French Laundry dinner party?) but for harshness. In Britain, the WhatsApp leak has been narrativized by the British press as a cartoon of feckless leadership. In the United States, the equivalent leak was the “Twitter files,” when internal company deliberations over pandemic messaging were examined by contrarian quasi-journalists deputized by Elon Musk shortly after his takeover of the company. The rhetorical emphasis was to hype public health guidance as near-totalitarian, as though those pursuing restrictions regarded severity as something like an ideological end of its own.

Given how panicked and supportive of mitigation measures Americans were in the spring of 2020 — and how much infection and death lay just ahead — the idea that pandemic response was largely defined by excess and overreach may seem extreme. But in its softer form the belief is no longer confined to the skeptical margins of social media’s anti-establishment.

Last weekend, The Times published a survey of pandemic recommendations from experts considering the possibility of another outbreak, and it looked to me as though in nearly every case even those taking the more aggressive side of the argument endorsed mitigation measures that were no stronger and often weaker or more caveated than those that had been put in place in 2020. They did so even though the hypothetical disease they were considering was both more transmissible and more deadly than the new coronavirus (and even though it also affected children and adults equally). That is, faced with a disease that would spread more quickly than Covid, kill more of those infected than Covid, with a mortality burden, compared with Covid’s, markedly rebalanced toward the young, they would vote, in general, to do less.

This isn’t a question limited to abstract, virtual-reality-style debates on op-ed pages and social media. In at least 30 states, The Washington Post reported last week, legislatures have already passed laws limiting public health powers in the wake of the pandemic. Most of the states are in Republican control, but not all, and the restrictions legislated so far are quite intrusive: in many cases, extending outright bans against health officials or governors from issuing mask mandates, closing schools or businesses, restricting large gatherings in places like churches, or testing or vaccine protocols. But what is most striking is how little consideration they give to the particular attributes of future outbreaks — treating a future disease that spreads like measles but kills one in five kids it infects the same as one that spreads like swine flu and doesn’t kill anybody. And stopping public health authorities from doing anything about any of them.

Stop and think about that for a second: As the country emerges from three years of death, disruption and suffering, dozens of states have decided not just that future mitigation measures should be carefully targeted and calibrated, or that they should be time-limited, or that they should always integrate trade-offs and cost-benefit calculations from the beginning. They have decided that the best way to prepare for those future diseases is to tie our hands ahead of time.

Is this the lesson the country should be taking from its experience with Covid-19? More than a million Americans died, and several hundred more continue to each day, keeping the country on a path to more than 100,000 Covid-19 deaths annually. Polls continue to show significant public support for mitigation measures like masking, believe it or not. These kinds of surveys are notoriously unreliable and may well significantly overstate such support, but last fall’s elections tell something of the same story: Candidates who were Covid hard-liners weren’t punished for their policies any more than skeptical or hands-off governors. These dynamics may shift again, as the country pulls past exhaustion toward some real pandemic perspective — which many of the installments of Opinion’s Next Pandemic series attempt to provide. But for now, at the level of policy and public discourse, a striking American consensus seems to be hardening: When Covid-19 hit, the country did too much.

The epidemiologist Katelyn Jetelina calls this “a new phase of the pandemic — revisionism.” To me, it looks almost like brain fog, with the deadliest public health crisis in a century already so out of focus in our collective memory that we find ourselves talking at the level of abstract principles as though they bear no relationship to the brutal reality of the early pandemic, producing talking points so disconnected from real history they can be put to any narrative purpose that suits.

This is not to say that the early months of the pandemic represent an eternal mitigation ideal, or even that they were as well calibrated as they might have been. But I am sure that any potential infection delayed until mass vaccination was a public-health win and that we can’t just retroactively cut-and-paste the social preferences we’ve settled on post-Omicron — after years of vaccination, disease spread and natural immunity, and mass death — onto our memories of 2020 as though we’re rebooting a pandemic video game now knowing how best to play it. And yet instead of thinking carefully about how the game has changed and how different circumstances require different responses, we seem to be modeling policy for future pandemics based on the world we inhabit now rather than the one we did when the virus first began spreading. Most of the time, no one really seems to notice that presentist legerdemain, perhaps because so few of us actually remember the experience of 2020 all that clearly and are clinging to hastily imposed narratives instead.

Consider the story circulating now — through essays, columns, podcasts and commentary on the pandemic’s geopolitical context — about China. Beginning in the fall — first with protests against the country’s “zero Covid” policies and then with news of its abrupt end — foreign observers, including me, warned about the humanitarian disaster the country was steering toward. Given more than a billion people with almost no exposure to the virus itself and a vulnerable elderly population that was disproportionately unvaccinated, the unmitigated spread of some extremely transmissible Omicron variants was projected to produce more than a million deaths in short order. When that brutal wave came, Western commentators were quick to declare a kind of debate-club victory and call China’s stubborn Covid-containment policy, for so long a global outlier, an obvious failure.

The data tells a more complicated story and illustrates that these questions are rarely binary or one-size-fits-all. According to estimates published last month by The Times, probably one million Chinese — and perhaps as many as 1.6 million — died when the country relaxed its Covid restrictions. That is a harrowing toll, especially in just two or three months. But it would mean that China’s per capita death toll through the whole pandemic was still less than a third of America’s.

And that may well understate the gap. The Economist maintains what is probably the single best database of global excess mortality throughout the pandemic, and the enormously wide range of its China estimate is telling — we simply know much less about the ultimate cost of the disease there than in almost any other country. But the very highest end of The Economist’s estimate for China, 220 excess deaths per 100,000, represents a pandemic death toll that is barely half the very lowest end of the U.S. estimate, 390 deaths per 100,000. If you take the median estimate for each country, the American per capita death toll would be four times as high. Which is to say that, to judge by excess mortality, if China failed the pandemic, the United States failed four times as hard.

Of course, mortality is not the only way to judge pandemic response. But while many other aspects are difficult to measure directly, economic performance is one decent proxy for how much the pandemic disrupted the day-to-day life of each country.

The United States has, by global standards, an enviable record. Thanks in large part to unprecedented federal relief spending, the country stands out. It is alone among its peer countries in not just recovering from the initial pandemic shutdown but also, as soon as late 2021, surpassing the levels of economic growth forecast for that quarter before the pandemic even hit. But even on this metric, China’s economic record is better, with Chinese G.D.P. growing, according to the I.M.F., from $14.3 trillion in 2019 to $18.32 trillion in 2022 — growth of about 28 percent. American G.D.P., by contrast, has grown from $21.4 trillion to only $25 trillion — 17 percent. Of course, Chinese data is notoriously unreliable, and the countries were on different growth trajectories heading into the pandemic, which means it isn’t exactly fair to compare them so simplistically. But it also makes it hard to look at China’s record and think simply, “disaster.” Over three years, the country’s people died a lot less and the country grew a bunch more.

What, then, is the precise nature of the Chinese “failure”? One answer is the lockdowns and “zero Covid” policy itself. The problems with vaccination rollout are especially striking to me, considering how much higher rates were among the young and the middle-aged than the elderly and infirm. Another might be that the error was essentially a matter of sequence: that the ultimate mistake of China’s pandemic response was to endure its most catastrophic wave not when the planet was almost paralyzed by panic but when the rest of the world had decided the disease was no big deal.

But here the experience in China is striking, too, at least as well as it can be observed from abroad — a sign that three years in, the Chinese are happy to trade unmitigated transmission for some freedom from pandemic restrictions, too. Remember, though economic headwinds surely played a role, “zero Covid” was brought to an end in part by unprecedented nationwide protest. There has been no evident equivalent protest against the hands-off approach that followed, no visible upswelling of outrage over the possibility of a million deaths and the indifference of Xi Jinping and the Chinese Communist Party to that carnage. “Can a million Chinese people die and nobody know?” Michael Schuman asked in The Atlantic last month, wondering about how little those outside the country had heard about the recent deaths within it. But the domestic fallout, or lack thereof, is even more striking — that a million people might die without the country really caring. Or perhaps it shouldn’t be striking so much as a sign of global convergence — that three years on, the whole world has acquiesced. Even the longest holdouts are normalizing mass death now, too.
 
They try to make it seem like it was accidental. It was all intentional. If you remember when Covid first hit the US the Democrats were shitting on Trump for anything he did. Especially calling it China virus. That was racist and evil. Trump either did too much or wasn't doing enough. The whole point of pushing the Covis fear to the max was to get the mail in ballots so they could steal the election in 2020. It was to get rid of Trump and make him look bad. That's all it was about. They kept the Covid fearmongering go well after the election because they had to for appearances. If they just suddenly did a 180 on it people would have said "it was just to get rid of Trump". They had to keep it going for a while.

The good thing is they have totally fucked themselves with it. It's just now coming back to bite them in the ass. It's totally wrecked the US economy which wasn't doing so well anyway. They printed up a bunch of money for Covid relief which caused inflation to increase. They had to raise interest rates to try and bring inflation back down. This is one of the things causing the banks to fail now.

In the end everything they did and have done to get rid of Trump is just going to make his 2024 comeback easier.
 
They try to make it seem like it was accidental. It was all intentional. If you remember when Covid first hit the US the Democrats were shitting on Trump for anything he did. Especially calling it China virus. That was racist and evil. Trump either did too much or wasn't doing enough. The whole point of pushing the Covis fear to the max was to get the mail in ballots so they could steal the election in 2020. It was to get rid of Trump and make him look bad. That's all it was about. They kept the Covid fearmongering go well after the election because they had to for appearances. If they just suddenly did a 180 on it people would have said "it was just to get rid of Trump". They had to keep it going for a while.

The good thing is they have totally fucked themselves with it. It's just now coming back to bite them in the ass. It's totally wrecked the US economy which wasn't doing so well anyway. They printed up a bunch of money for Covid relief which caused inflation to increase. They had to raise interest rates to try and bring inflation back down. This is one of the things causing the banks to fail now.

In the end everything they did and have done to get rid of Trump is just going to make his 2024 comeback easier.
They'll need someone to blame for the next World War
 
so few of us actually remember the experience of 2020 all that clearly and are clinging to hastily imposed narratives instead.
No, journo, people remember it quite well, and that's why they hate you and everything you covid cultists represent. Ironically the worst part about 2020 wasn't even covid, it was the race riots cheerled by Dems who saw tearing apart America as a fun political tool to boost their election chances. 'Racism in Trump's America is a worse pandemic than covid, go out and riot'.

In my view, 2021 was actually the worst year of the pandemic when they really started to divide people with vax/unvaxxed and vax-passport type shit. Once they had a very identifiable 'enemy' they leaned really hard into the authoritarianism. Society was technically more open than in 2020, but the top-down oppressive measures were also more refined.
 
The Uk already had a flu plan. We already had a sensible and proportionate plan for dealing with an epidemic disease at various severity levels.
All the measures in it were utterly ignored and we got a draconian lockdown that did absolutely nothing to stop covid but which damaged our health, economy and sanity.
If you look at the excess death data for Europe just now, Sweden is lower than us. The lockdowns killed people, and will continue to kill people and everyone involved in pushing them should be in court
 
-New Zealand and/or Australia building literal concentration camps for the sick and other places passing laws allowing for forcible confinement of non-vaxxed
How about this cunt telling people to visit the NZ gov website to get your information and to dismiss anything else. "We will continue to be your single source of truth."

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/coron...n-on-social-media/I2FTKPSA36LJIDNLBFIYECXDHM/ (archive.ph)
 
I'd love for some accountability or data leaks from the Canadian and provincial governments, but it'll likely be suppressed hard, or basically ignored by the government like the current China election interference CSIS leaks happening here.

Quebec - Canada's second largest province, had 7 months of curfews in 2021, with the second curfew ending Jan 2022. They had ZERO evidence to justify putting the curfew in Dec 2021, but did so anyway, because fuck you.

 
Excellent, admitting fault while blaming others and re-writing history.

Next up, how covid lockdowns wouldn't have been bad if people spoke out.

Followed by, how covid lockdowns were never forced, everyone knew they were bad but people did them anyway.
 
What, not trying to blame everything on Trump? The NYT is slipping.
I guess the NYT adopted this strategy to distant themselves from the rest of the msm when TSHF after not covering Hunter Biden's desktop.
I'd love for some accountability or data leaks from the Canadian and provincial governments, but it'll likely be suppressed hard, or basically ignored by the government like the current China election interference CSIS leaks happening here.

Quebec - Canada's second largest province, had 7 months of curfews in 2021, with the second curfew ending Jan 2022. They had ZERO evidence to justify putting the curfew in Dec 2021, but did so anyway, because fuck you.

I heard lots of rumors they was advised by a company named McKinsey who also advised other governments like France.
 
the restrictions legislated so far are quite intrusive: in many cases, extending outright bans against health officials or governors from issuing mask mandates, closing schools or businesses, restricting large gatherings in places like churches, or testing or vaccine protocols. But what is most striking is how little consideration they give to the particular attributes of future outbreaks — treating a future disease that spreads like measles but kills one in five kids it infects the same as one that spreads like swine flu and doesn’t kill anybody. And stopping public health authorities from doing anything about any of them.

No one's telling school districts and businesses they can't close on their own, or that people can't choose to mask if they prefer. I haven't seen one jurisdiction promoting a ban on masking from people doing so voluntarily. If there was a disease out there killing 1/5th of the people who got it, young and old, people would be taking any measures they possibly could against it. People would not go to work or send their kids to school, because even being unable to pay the bills is better than someone in the house literally dying, and elected state or national legislatures could make regulations as needed.

The only thing being taken away here was the ability of, specifically, unelected public health authorities to make these rules instead of a legislature and executive chosen by the people.

No one needs to consider the "attributes" of future outbreaks to determine which outbreaks are appropriate times for public health authorities to supercede the authority of elected officials. The answer is none. No outbreaks can have a combination of attributes that suddenly make appointed public health officials into dictators who can control almost every aspect of the economy and public life.
 
They try to make it seem like it was accidental. It was all intentional. If you remember when Covid first hit the US the Democrats were shitting on Trump for anything he did. Especially calling it China virus. That was racist and evil. Trump either did too much or wasn't doing enough. The whole point of pushing the Covis fear to the max was to get the mail in ballots so they could steal the election in 2020. It was to get rid of Trump and make him look bad. That's all it was about. They kept the Covid fearmongering go well after the election because they had to for appearances. If they just suddenly did a 180 on it people would have said "it was just to get rid of Trump". They had to keep it going for a while.

The good thing is they have totally fucked themselves with it. It's just now coming back to bite them in the ass. It's totally wrecked the US economy which wasn't doing so well anyway. They printed up a bunch of money for Covid relief which caused inflation to increase. They had to raise interest rates to try and bring inflation back down. This is one of the things causing the banks to fail now.

In the end everything they did and have done to get rid of Trump is just going to make his 2024 comeback easier.
Everything they did to make stealing the election easier in 2020 is still in place. You're a retard if you think anything will be different come 2024.
 
Selective Revisionism.

We'll never forget how handing out 600 dollar checks completely destroyed the economy because our government couldn't pull 3 trillion out of thin air to protect American people, but we will quickly forgot how our government just pulled 10 trillion out of thin air to protect Ukraine and the Banks, while being 24... I mean 34 trillion dollars in debt whoopsies, 44 Trillion, the slide hasn't happened yet.

I mean it's a real tough choice at the end of the day. Protect the people that fund the goverment or protect the people who hide their money from the government.
 
I'd like to believe this was true, but I didn't believe American citizens would have allowed it the first time around and we did with barely a complaint.
Would say at that time there was still some trust in TPTB. As time went by TPTB showed their true tyrannical colors and resistance increased. Judiciary quickly got behind on adjudicating lawsuits against TPTB. As suits were adjudicated, the people often won, forcing "them" to back off and back down some. But now people know what to expect.

Sadly, two of the worst, Newsom and Whitmer, were re-elected. Sickening; those who voted them are despicable. One reason I don't volunteer or contribute in the town where I live, not doing or donating anything that could help Newsom supporters. Should I ever hit the big one, taking the money and leaving the state.
 
No one's telling school districts and businesses they can't close on their own, or that people can't choose to mask if they prefer. I haven't seen one jurisdiction promoting a ban on masking from people doing so voluntarily. If there was a disease out there killing 1/5th of the people who got it, young and old, people would be taking any measures they possibly could against it. People would not go to work or send their kids to school, because even being unable to pay the bills is better than someone in the house literally dying, and elected state or national legislatures could make regulations as needed.

The only thing being taken away here was the ability of, specifically, unelected public health authorities to make these rules instead of a legislature and executive chosen by the people.

No one needs to consider the "attributes" of future outbreaks to determine which outbreaks are appropriate times for public health authorities to supercede the authority of elected officials. The answer is none. No outbreaks can have a combination of attributes that suddenly make appointed public health officials into dictators who can control almost every aspect of the economy and public life.
Remember, folks, three times as many, per the fucking CDC, died of heart disease and cancer, then and now. Yet we didn't fuck up our country treating and trying to stop the spread of those diseases. Apples and oranges? Don't fucking think so, as someone who's had open-heart, cancer, and the coof. Of the three, the coof gave me the least reason for concern. And the number dying of heart disease increases every year.
 
The degree to which things have been memoryholed and changeed over the past couple years makes me think I'm going insane. The heel turn that the left did once they realized they could use covid against Blumpf is one of the most amazing thing I've ever seen and nobody outside of communities like these remembers what the discourse was before March/April of 2020. This old tweet summarizes that early stage of covid perfectly.

Capture.PNG
 
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