Science Has microbial life been found on Venus? - Ayy Lmao

  • 🇵🇦 Nuestro primer dominio localizado está en español en kiwifarms.pa. Our first localized domain is on Spanish on kiwifarms.pa.
  • Want to keep track of this thread?
    Accounts can bookmark posts, watch threads for updates, and jump back to where you stopped reading.
    Create account
EarthSky messed up by publishing an article that was meant for tomorrow, the 14th, and luckily, someone archived it before they hit the delete button. Nature will publish a paper tomorrow where MIT researchers discuss the detection of phosphine gas in Venus' atmosphere. Phosphine is considered a biomarker, meaning that its presence likely indicates the presence of certain forms of life that produce it, as researchers couldn't find any way it could form without human or biological action. Here's the archive of the article: (the links within aren't working for obvious reasons)
https://archive.is/L7MT1

Most of us are familiar with the old quote from Arthur Conan Doyle, “Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.” Those words may be more apropos than ever this week, as scientists announced an incredible discovery: tentative evidence for microbial life on Venus! As we know, Venus is a scorching and inhospitable world on the surface, probably the last place you’d expect to find any kind of life. But the hints of these tiny Venusians comes not from the planet’s surface, but rather from higher up in its atmosphere, where conditions can be remarkably Earth-like.

The exciting findings come from scientists in the US and UK, at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT), Cardiff University, University of Manchester and others. Jane Greaves of Cardiff University lead the study.

The new peer-reviewed research paper was published in Nature Astronomy today, September 14, 2020. The Royal Astronomical Society also provided an online press briefing for journalists via Zoom, with three of the researchers to discuss the results, as well as issuing its own news release.

It should be noted that this is not quite yet proof of life on Venus, but the researchers make a compelling case.

For as long as we’ve known about conditions on the planet thanks to visiting space probes, Venus has always been considered one of the least likely to support life of any kind. With scorching temperatures hot enough to melt lead and crushing air pressure at the surface, along with large amounts of sulfuric acid in its clouds, Venus is far from being a welcoming place.

Some scientists, however, have speculated that life might be possible higher up in the atmosphere, where temperatures and pressures are Earth-like in a “temperate zone.” It is in this zone that the discovery was made.


What did the researchers find?
Simply put, a gas that shouldn’t be there, and on Earth is considered a conclusive biosignature: phosphine, a very stinky gas. As far as scientists know, there are only two ways to produce it, either artificially in a lab, or by certain kinds of microbes that live in oxygen-free environments. Since it is rather unlikely there any alien labs on Venus, that leaves microbes.
The researchers made the detection using the James Clerk Maxwell Telescope (JCMT) in Hawaii, and the Atacama Large Millimeter Array (ALMA) observatory in Chile.
Researchers from MIT had previously published studies showing that if phosphine was to ever be found on another rocky planet, it would be a sure sign of life there. Hence why this discovery is so provocative. But before announcing this tantalizing evidence, the researchers, of course, wanted to try to rule out other explanations. They considered and tested many various scenarios where this gas might be produced without life, but as they acknowledge, they came up empty. Clara Sousa-Silva at MIT, whose career specialty is studying phosphine, said in a statement:
It’s very hard to prove a negative. Now, astronomers will think of all the ways to justify phosphine without life, and I welcome that. Please do, because we are at the end of our possibilities to show abiotic processes that can make phosphine.
Finding phosphine on Venus was an unexpected bonus! The discovery raises many questions, such as how any organisms could survive. On Earth, some microbes can cope with up to about 5% of acid in their environment, but the clouds of Venus are almost entirely made of acid.


Co-author Janusz Petkowski added:

This means either this is life, or it’s some sort of physical or chemical process that we do not expect to happen on rocky planets.
We really went through all possible pathways that could produce phosphine on a rocky planet. If this is not life, then our understanding of rocky planets is severely lacking.
That’s a pretty definitive statement to make.

Greaves said:

This was an experiment made out of pure curiosity, really, taking advantage of JCMT’s powerful technology, and thinking about future instruments. I thought we’d just be able to rule out extreme scenarios, like the clouds being stuffed full of organisms. When we got the first hints of phosphine in Venus’ spectrum, it was a shock!
The researchers processed the data for six months before becoming convinced the phosphine was really there. According to Anita Richards, of the UK ALMA Regional Centre and The University of Manchester:

To our great relief, the conditions were good at ALMA for follow-up observations while Venus was at a suitable angle to Earth. Processing the data was tricky, though, as ALMA isn’t usually looking for very subtle effects in very bright objects like Venus.




at MIT, who led the work on trying to assess other natural ways to make phosphine on Venus. Some ideas included sunlight, minerals blown upwards from the surface, volcanoes, or lightning, but none of these could make anywhere near enough of it. These kinds of sources could only make, at most, one ten thousandth of the amount of phosphine that the telescopes saw. So something is producing a lot more of the gas. According to Paul Rimmer at Cambridge University, terrestrial organisms would only need to work at about 10% of their maximum productivity in order to produce the amount of phosphine found on Venus.

On Earth, phosphine is produced by microbes that don’t need oxygen. They absorb phosphate minerals, add hydrogen, and ultimately expel phosphine gas. Since Venus has virtually no oxygen in its atmosphere, that’s another similarity suggesting the gas actually is coming from microbes.

Since Venus is much too hot at its surface for any known earthly microbes, they must be in its atmosphere. There is a temperate region, between 48 and 60 kilometers above the surface, where temperatures range from 30 to 200 degrees Fahrenheit. That’s the habitable zone on Venus, and just happens to be where the phosphine was found. As Petkowski noted:

 
That would be cool if we found life. Even on a hellish planet like Venus I would be happy knowing there are microscopic life forums alive in Venus' atmosphere. Imagine, decades from now NASA scientists announce they have indeed found life and it was Venus the whole time; not Mars.
 
.....it’s happening?

Also, help a sister out: there’s a novel or short story where the Venusian colonists live in giant zeppelins high in Venus’ clouds. I can’t remember the name or author of it and it’s really bugging me. Any ideas?
 
There's been a lot of interesting speculation on this for a while since Venus was once earthlike and still is high up in the atmosphere (minus the whole sulfuric acid thing) so it's plausible the same space rocks that seeded Earth with life might've done the same there. Very cool to see more about it.
 
That's incredibly interesting that there could be organisms that perpetually live in the atmosphere without ever coming into contact with a hard, physical surface. I wonder what means of movement, if any, they would have. Would they just be like "jellyfish", drifting through the atmosphere in an uncoordinated way?
And the extreme conditions of Venus shouldn't be used to automatically shoot down any thoughts of organisms. Here on Earth we already have extremeophiles such as Tardigrades that can survive in remarkable conditions that no other organisms can. Harder for them to initially form? Maybe, but not impossible.
 
The implications of this are HUGE. I can not capitalize that word enough. If life formed separately on two planets with radically different environments in the same solar system, then life can't be that rare of an occurrence. If this is true, our universe is quite possibly teeming with it.
 
The implications of this are HUGE. I can not capitalize that word enough. If life formed separately on two planets with radically different environments in the same solar system, then life can't be that rare of an occurrence. If this is true, our universe is quite possibly teeming with it.
That would be poggers, I wonder what would happen if we brought it home and how it might evolve over time
 
Hasn’t similar “proof” been found on Enceladus

Nothingburger until hard evidence is found

Also looks like the leak on /x/ was correct
When were you when an /x/ LARP thread was proven to be true
When the larp becomes real.png
?
 
I wonder what would happen if we brought it home and how it might evolve over time
One of two things.

Scenario A.) Whatever it is does not survive the journey (think every "blobfish" exposed to sea level and above antipressures)
Scenario B.) Congratulations! You've just introduced an alien species with alien life on it that may or may not be invasive. Good luck if it is.
 
Pentagon releases alien footage. Trump reinvigorates space programs. Space force created.
Looks like the next crusade will be to venus.

Suffer not the alien to live, brothers!
 
It's very interesting, but aside from a compelling circumstantial case is there anything we can do in our life times that's reasonably affordable to confirm one way or another? Can we shoot a suicide probe into the atmosphere to see what's there before it gets crushed?
 
Betteridge's Law of Headlines (the answer to a question is always no).

Most of us are familiar with the old quote from Arthur Conan Doyle, “Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.”

ACD wrote an interesting if bizarre book (I have read basically every word he ever wrote) evangelizing the existence of fairies. In his case, the "impossible" was any circumstance premised on a couple English slatterns lying.
 
Cant wait for the fucking articles linking this to politics somehow

"New evidence suggests Trump has been ignoring the plight of our planetary neighbors for 5 billion years"



Betteridge's Law of Headlines (the answer to a question is always no).



ACD wrote an interesting if bizarre book (I have read basically every word he ever wrote) evangelizing the existence of fairies. In his case, the "impossible" was any circumstance premised on a couple English slatterns lying.

He kinda proved his own point, by hilighting a major weakness in it: the danger of biased eliminations of those "impossible" theories because you just don't like them.

A couple kids lying for attention is one of the most-possible things on Earth, you'd think a great Detective would know that... Conan Doyle fell for a simple cognitive flaw in the argument (The arguer them-self decides what's impossible) that Holmes himself would've stepped right over.

It's where all the "I FUCKING LOVE SCIENCE!" people fall off the wagon too: 5,000 mainstream scientists are wrong and ignorant, but my 1 kook in a labcoat is RIGHT!
 
Última edición:
Atrás
Top Abajo