UN President Macron's Petain Nazi collaborator remark creates row - Macron nous voila

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46129990

French President Emmanuel Macron has sought to justify paying homage to Nazi collaborator Philippe Pétain during centenary commemorations marking the end of World War One later this week.

Mr Macron said Marshal Pétain was a "great soldier", even though he had made "disastrous choices" during WW2.

Pétain was praised for the defence of Verdun in 1916, but he was sentenced to death for high treason after WW2.

Some French politicians and Jewish leaders condemned Mr Macron's comments.
What did Mr Macron say?
Speaking during a tour of northern France in Charleville-Mezieres, the president said: "It's right that we honour the marshals who led France to victory (in WW1)."

And referring to Pétain, Mr Macron said: "He was a great soldier", although he had made "disastrous choices" during the Nazi occupation of France.

Petain co-operated with the Nazi invaders and headed a puppet government centred on the spa town of Vichy.

Mr Macron's office later defended his comments.

"I'm not forgiving anything, but I'm not going to erase anything from our history," he said, stressing that Pétain was "complicit in grave crimes".

And addressing reporters, he added: "You're creating controversies by yourselves."

On Saturday, a ceremony will be held in Paris to commemorate the eight marshals - including Pétain - who led the French army in WW1.
What has been reaction in France?
A number of French politicians criticised President Macron.
Left-wing leader Jean-Luc Mélenchon, who leads the France Unbowed party, described Pétain as "a traitor and an anti-Semite".

Mr Mélenchon added: "Macron, this time you've gone too far! The history of France is not your toy."
Meanwhile, Francis Kalifat of the CRIF association of French Jewish groups said he was "shocked" by Mr Macron's comments praising a Nazi collaborator who helped send thousands of Jews to their deaths.

"The only thing we will remember about Petain is that he was convicted, in the name of the French people, of national indignity during his trial in 1945," Mr Kalifat said.

Who was Philippe Pétain?
He was born in 1856, and joined the French army 20 years later.

Pétain was seen by many in France as a national hero for restoring army morale after Verdun - the largest and longest battle in WW1.

In 1918, he was made a marshal of France.

In 1940, with France under attack from Germany, Pétain was appointed vice-premier. He later asked for an armistice, upon which he was appointed "chief of state", enjoying almost absolute powers.

The armistice gave the Germans control over the north and west of France, including Paris, but left the remainder as a separate regime under Pétain.

Officially neutral, in practice the regime collaborated closely with Germany, and brought in its own anti-Semitic legislation.

After the end of WW2, Pétain was arrested and sentenced to death for high treason. This was then commuted to life imprisonment given his age.

Pétain died in 1951 at the age of 95.

 

[TowinKarz]

French Nazis......



The very WORST kind.

 

[IV 445]

French Nazis......



The very WORST kind.

Didn’t even have to comply with the German government. They freely sold out their Jewish citizens.

 

[ICametoLurk]

Didn’t even have to comply with the German government. They freely sold out their Jewish citizens.

Well if you know that someone whose interested in removing something you don't like is in the area, might as well use the opportunity.

 

[ColtWalker1847]

Petain was a pretty good WWI general though. One of the few competent Entente ones. Without him that war would have been very different. WW2, not so much. He was just a figurehead.

 

[breadandcircuses]

You know why Petain's sentence was commuted?

De Gaulle BEGGED the tribunal to commute it to a life sentence, because Petain was the Lion of Verdun! A hero of the great war.

It's a great shame that that guys like von Macksen and Petain died... you know... not in war.

Petain, in particular, he was suffering dementia during his last years.

 

[CharlesBarkley]

Lol at French war heros.

 

[millais]

I don't see how this is a controversial opinion. Pretty much everyone agrees that Marechal Petain should be praised for his good work in the first war and condemned for his failings in the second, though even then I don't blame him too much since they literally dragged him out of retirement to negotiate the armistice and set up the Vichy government, and he just happened to be the one left holding the bag in the end.

People should be more upset that Macron bangs old granny pussy on the regular

 

[Absolutego]

Lol at French war heros.

The mantra of every American whose knowledge of French military history starts and ends at WWII.

 

[Kirito]

Wasn't George Soros also a nazi collaborator? I'd like to see everyone complaining about Petain also condemn him and his activities.

 

[Absolutego]

Wasn't George Soros also a nazi collaborator? I'd like to see everyone complaining about Petain also condemn him and his activities.

Comparing an, admittedly addled, man in his 80's intentionally moving back to France to be a figurehead for the Nazi-established government with the actions of a 12 year old already in Nazi-occupied territory in terms of moral character is retarded.

The Nazi collaborator stuff has always been the dumbest anti-Soros criticism, especially given the litany of immoral acts more recent and unjustifiable in his history.

 

[RadicalCentrist]

The mantra of every American whose knowledge of French military history starts and ends at WWII.

Not really surprising when French military history ends at WWII, period

 

[Kirito]

Comparing an, admittedly addled, man in his 80's intentionally moving back to France to be a figurehead for the Nazi-established government with the actions of a 12 year old already in Nazi-occupied territory in terms of moral character is exceptional.

The Nazi collaborator stuff has always been the dumbest anti-Soros criticism, especially given the litany of immoral acts more recent and unjustifiable in his history.

They all agree with those actions though and sing his praises.
All nazis are bad, they shouldnt be able to pick and choose after everything they say about them

 

[Absolutego]

They all agree with those actions though and sing his praises.
All nazis are bad, they shouldnt be able to pick and choose after everything they say about them

I guarantee you even the people who agree with the political causes Soros funds would take issue with him deliberately crashing a country's economy for profit. Multiple times.

Soros is about as sleazy and conniving as a billionaire can get.

 

[Kirito]

he was a teenage boy and was living with some hungarian government employee whose job was managing confiscated jew property, that's it. you can't seriously call that "nazi collaborator" with a straight face.

Sounds like you're a nazi apologist
Seriously though, I don't believe he's a nazi. I just wanna see these people called out on their bullshit where anyone who associated with the nazis for any reason was literally hitler.

 

[Male Idiot]

But if Orban went to praise Horthy who was in a rather similar position except he was more reluctantly collaborating, this would blow up and Macaroni would go "REEE NAZI REEE!" .

 

[registered 2 hide avatars]

Not really surprising when French military history ends at WWII, period

What does that have to do at all with his post?

 

[Y2K Baby]

Didn’t even have to comply with the German government. They freely sold out their Jewish citizens.

We all would.

The mantra of every American whose knowledge of French military history starts and ends at WWII.

WTF, I hate America now.

 

[ICametoLurk]

I don't see how this is a controversial opinion. Pretty much everyone agrees that Marechal Petain should be praised for his good work in the first war and condemned for his failings in the second, though even then I don't blame him too much since they literally dragged him out of retirement to negotiate the armistice and set up the Vichy government, and he just happened to be the one left holding the bag in the end.

People should be more upset that Macron bangs old granny pussy on the regular

Petain was a figure-head who had 2 options, be the sock-puppet for the English or the sock-puppet for the Nazis. The Nazis had shown that the British army wasn't worth a damn, so he decided to choose the choice that seemed more likely to win. The third choice was to be executed, something that is easy to talk about but hard to do for yourself when the cards are down - not every guy has the guts to walk up to their own execution platform, and Petain only accepted his position instead of fleeing because he wanted to at least buffer nazi control of France.

Having your country and your people bleed for Angl*ids would be the real treason.

 

[millais]

Petain was a figure-head who had 2 options, be the sock-puppet for the English or the sock-puppet for the Nazis. The Nazis had shown that the British army wasn't worth a damn, so he decided to choose the choice that seemed more likely to win. The third choice was to be executed, something that is easy to talk about but hard to do for yourself when the cards are down - not every guy has the guts to walk up to their own execution platform, and Petain only accepted his position instead of fleeing because he wanted to at least buffer nazi control of France.

Having your country and your people bleed for Angl*ids would be the real treason.

It was definitely a "only Nixon could go to China" situation. The government had already lost much of its legitimacy due to half of the ministers resigning over the shame of the battlefield defeats and the other half fleeing to England without permission to set up a rival government-in-exile, and Marechal Petain was the only man with strong enough political credibility and popular reputation to survive the blow of signing the armistice. He only did it out of love for his country and to spare the people from further bloodshed. It was definitely the least worst option at a time when it looked like England would be knocked out of the war in just a few more months.

But in the end, it was all for naught. The Angloids destroyed the fleet at Mers El Kebir, killed thousands of Frenchmen in the invasions of Vichy North Africa and Syria and Madagascar, and pretty much self-fulfilled the prophecy of turning the Vichy against the Allied war effort. Up until then, they were quite content to sit out the rest of the war as a non-belligerent.