Iran Crisis & the 2026 War between Iran and the United States, Gulf States, and Israel - Please focus on news and coverage, not argumentation.

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The problem with the current posture is that there is a million reasonable reasons for the current course.

Unfortunately some of those reasonable reasons are huge signs of weakness. I dont believe for a second we are out of bombs but the current behavior feeds that narrative to the sandnigger mind. Compassion and mercy and temperance are weakness to sand niggers. They dont have Christian virtures and will not respond in kind.

Trump is not bloodthirsty, he doesnt want to kill off a bunch of Iranians. We will not get bridge and power plant day unless they actually do some major shit. That also basically locks in the war market and removes Iran from oil markets entirely.

The "he wont do anything because Charles" has moved "he wont move because Xi" whats the next excuse? Meeting with Africa?

Also this Pakistan shit has gotten old. They keep making requests while delivering nothing.

At this point it is clear the next set of iran leadership needs to be killed. The current crop cant make a deal, you keep killing them till one learns to say yes.

The whole "its letting them rebuild" shit seems wrong to me. Letting them reassemble focal points of leadership and resources creates new things to bomb.
 
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namelesstacotruck dijo:
At this point it is clear the next set of iran leadership needs to be killed. The current crop cant make a deal, you keep killing them till one learns to say yes.
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The whole "They're much more reasonable than the previous group" line reads to me as they simply learned that they can't openly brag about their apocalyptic plans behind closed doors because Trump actually takes that rhetoric seriously.
They can spin all their public statements as just chest-thumping while going full "IT'S ALL AN ACT SAAR WE RESPECT YOU GREATLY SAAR JUST GIVE US TWO MORE WEEKS SAAR" whenever they have a private phone call.
 
BigJoey41X dijo:
Just so we can establish a baseline to discuss with, what are the criteria both of you consider to say the war is/could be a "quagmire"?
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Something like Vietnam, Iraq or Afghanistan, or Russia right now in Ukraine where we were there for far longer with far higher costs and casualties.

It's odd to me to think that 2 months in, and with our losses remarkably low considering the extent of our combat actions taken. That people would be calling this a quagmire.

As much as people incorrectly state "Trump planned for this to be over in 3 days" it seems more like the general public has some bizarre distorted sense of the duration of military operations and are acting like this 2 month engagement is the same as 5 years tanking losses by attrition.
 
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BigJoey41X dijo:
Just so we can establish a baseline to discuss with, what are the criteria both of you consider to say the war is/could be a "quagmire"?
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I would say the big thing is there is buttons Trump can press that he is choosing not too. He isnt putting troops in.

He could literally do one last wave of bombing and make sure to include their oil industry pull out the fleet and declare "we did it!" And it would be a way cleaner extrication than Afghanistan was and Europe and Asia would pay the price more than the US. Remember there are buttons on domestic oil he hasnt pressed yet like export restrictions.

Also it feels like its just building political capital with the Middle East countries and there are some gains being made.

I personally care less about the nuclear weapons and more that Iran had "death to america!" As their fucking pledge of allegiance for school children my entire life. I am also tired of hearing about them all the fucking time. No more death to america sand nigger faggots death to you instead.

If they did get a nuclear weapon they would nuke Israel or Europe or a Democrat bug hive most likely and all of that would bring a smile.
 
They must be hurting because they seem a lot less mouthy lately. I notice there seems to be a noticeable decrease in the prevalence of their vile mudslime propaganda and less energy for dooming about America fucking this up. I guess trump is coaxing them slowly out of the raccoon trap and into a burlap sack while avoiding getting bit. Maybe it is more pragmatic this way. It's actually disturbing to me that Trump represents a more judicious and moderated use of force than the typical American MO. We really just used to shit fire and pollution over fucking goat herders and lice-bitten peasants when we could just have a fiery but mostly peaceful with them. It's bittersweet. I guess I miss good old American barbarism.
 
Dumbledore's Onlyfans dijo:
Pakistan is 340,509 square miles in area. A 20 kiloton bomb such as those dropped on Japan during WWII destroyed a 10 square mile area in each city.
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A Minuteman III carrying a W87-1 has 20 times the blast yield of the bombs dropped on Japan in 1945.
Do we have bigger bombs now? Yes, we do, but we simply don't have enough in stock to do the job.
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We have more than enough nukes to wipe out every major city in Pakistan several times over.
On top of that, the larger the bomb, the higher the mushroom cloud goes into the air, and the further the fallout will spread.
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You say this like it's a bad thing.
 
namelesstacotruck dijo:
The problem with the current posture is that there is a million reasonable reasons for the current course.

Unfortunately some of those reasonable reasons are huge signs of weakness. I dont believe for a second we are out of bombs but the current behavior feeds that narrative to the sandnigger mind. Compassion and mercy and temperance are weakness to sand niggers. They dont have Christian virtures and will not respond in kind.

Trump is not bloodthirsty, he doesnt want to kill off a bunch of Iranians. We will not get bridge and power plant day unless they actually do some major shit. That also basically locks in the war market and removes Iran from oil markets entirely.

The "he wont do anything because Charles" has moved "he wont move because Xi" whats the next excuse? Meeting with Africa?

Also this Pakistan shit has gotten old. They keep making requests while delivering nothing.

At this point it is clear the next set of iran leadership needs to be killed. The current crop cant make a deal, you keep killing them till one learns to say yes.

The whole "its letting them rebuild" shit seems wrong to me. Letting them reassemble focal points of leadership and resources creates new things to bomb.
Presiona para expandir...
Welcome to the middle east. No one actually wants to change the status quo because they're afraid of a) muh markets and muh unknown b) muh oil or c) got to keep the hajis happy or they will do another 9/11 or what the Palestinians have been doing since '48. The real problem is that no one wants to do what NEEDS to be done. Instead we have decided to kick the can down th road and when they eventually blow up like they did on Oct 7 2023, try to close the proverbial Pandora's box. This is what biden, obama, dems and the euros don't understand. The status quo is unintendable. Yes bibi is a prick who's willing to fuck up everything for personal power, but at the end of the Arabs aren't doing anything to help themselves (Christ they listened to arafat and Hamas even though they can never realistically achieve their goals).

True "rebuilding" will only occur when the band-aid is ripped off and change is forced. You have these fancy experts with fancy degrees who are out of touch with reality. They believe it really is the "liberal world order" and that everyone still wants to buy blue jeans and thinks like its the Regan era. Trust me I have a bunch myself. They push muersheimer and fukyma like they aren't stupid hacks.

The uncomfortable truth is this: everyone who matters knows iran is a terror state, the israelis are technically correct but never do things to actually help their position and their "fuck you in right and you know I am" attitude doesn't exactly make friends in liberal areas even though the israelis are correct. The Saudis don't care about the Palestinians and the Saudis will be in competition with the UAE soon.

Lebanon is a failed state that needs to be broken up or thrusted back into civil war and Hezbollah just needs to be removed. Egypt, turkey, jordan and Algeria are shadows of what they once were. Look in short since definitely the 1978 iranian revolution and even more so since the arab spring, the middle east has perverably been stuck in the interwar period.

Also even though he killed a bunch of Vietnamese and Cambodians Kissinger along with Teddy Roosevelt and Trueman were the only person who knew how to put America first. Not Regan, not Trump, not vance.

You have to put your foot down and say "no" and be willing to back it up with overwhelming force. Not "we bomb them from the air". I mean we send the troops in and put a gun to their head.

Hamas takes Americans hostage? Move over Israel the 101st airbone in landing in gaza city.

The euros wont put ships through the straight? Well now every ship has a us escort and American sorties. Still scared? Fuck it, we will guarantee your safety. Iran won't listen to us? We will kill your leaders until you do and park troops on your (land) border. Your people won't start a rebellion? Fuck it's CIA and mossad fun time sponsored by us air power.

You bomb our allies because you're iran and you need be show you're a big man? RIP Iranian export ports.

You want to kick the mullahs out? We will need to do iraq 3 the sandbox returns. But it will require a gulf war/korea/ww2 level of commitment. We need to break their ideology in the same way we broke fascism as a realistic ideology. We cannot do this with airpower alone, we can not have a "mcwar" where "shit happens over there and not over here". Because one day we will wake up and iran will be bombing our shit like the Japanese did in 1941.

Israel ignored the problem and got Oct 7th. We ignored the issue and got 9/11. What will happen when we ignore the issue and they have the actual abilities of the state?
 
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namelesstacotruck dijo:
If they did get a nuclear weapon they would nuke Israel or Europe or a Democrat bug hive most likely and all of that would bring a smile.
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I'm seriously at a point where if I could get some magic guarantee that ensured Iran would only ever use a nuke on Europe, I'd say more power to 'em.

On a more humorous note, the latest version of the UN Resolution to open the Strait replaces glazing Pakistan with some generic fluffing of the IMO.
Izzat levels in the fucking negatives lol.
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The 180-degree shift in the mood whenever something is accounted for as a 'loss' is reminding me way too much of USPG2. Makes me rub my temples.
Can we just, I dunno, wait and see what happens without knee-jerking reacting so strongly that Trump fucked up? Every time I hear this 'he's an idiot and a moron for doing this, we're losing,' something else happens that makes the doubters suddenly quiet.

Maybe it's just me, but logic doesn't make sense that Iran is calling this a 'victory' when they're still being blockaded. They're still losing money, and unable to get oil out. That's a win, apparently? Okay, sure, whatever. I wish I knew what you're smoking to come to that conclusion. I'm not denying that he's been repetitive on the message that their navy and other assortments have been annihilated (I mean he's not wrong). My only guess is that he's trying to be unpredictable, or this was a test without officially saying it was a test to see if it worked, since there's a meeting coming up with Winnie the Pooh. The usual suspects are just too quick to give up and call it a loss, and call Trump retarded and so on, so forth.

Maybe he is retarded, maybe he isn't, I dunno! He does a bunch of unpredictable shit no one expects.
 
I just want to add these peace talks are bullshit. Fuck whatever Pakistan says, you want us to stop bombing? No nukes or anything that floats out of iran gets sunk. Remove the executive order and let the CIA start killing mother fuckers again.
 
Dumbledore's Onlyfans dijo:
This is 100% true, and was our basic strategy against Japan. I don't think strategic strikes count as "glassing" a country though. Theoretically "glassing" a country means leaving it with nothing but a layer of melted topsoil or sand. "Glassing" implies total annihilation in a way that "strategic strikes" does not.

I'd be very surprised if any current nuclear power used its bombs even for a strategic strike tbh. They could just use incendiaries to achieve the same result much more cheaply and efficiently (see: Dresden, Germany, WWII). Nuclear bombs are just a political equalizer now. "You can't push US around, we have bombs too!"
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All we have to do is ask Musk to find us an asteroid about 600 meters wide and slam it into the country.
Problem solved, and no radioactive fallout.
 
A quagmire is where your costs are more than you wanted or can afford to pay, but you can't leave for any number of unrelated reasons. Iraq was a quagmire because we were losing a soldier or two every day for years on end, and spending 150 billion dollars a year (plus another 2x that in long term vet care). And we couldn't leave because Al Qaeda in Iraq would take over the country and turn it into the clusterfuck the Islamic State ended up becoming, and we had committed our national credibility to seeing it through.

Ironically the people calling for 500 bombing sorties a day indefinitely are playing into the cost part of that trap where the regime just has to survive and launch a missile or drone to give the impression that they are winning because the US spending 25 billion dollars a month open ended and they still won't yield. Meanwhile the blockade costs a fraction of that and completely flips and the script and forces them into being the ones to militarily change the status quo.

Bridge and power plant day is definitely something we look forward to, but we also need to have a sustainable (for our budget) backup plan in case they decide their izzat is worth living under a mountain for the next year. Something relatively cheap and that can be maintained with no casualties and minimal costs indefinitely... something like I dunno a blockade?
 
Good lord everyone else is still so mad over Trump not going forward with Operation Freedom, did all of you actually believed in the self-imposed image of him being the big balls tough guy on the world stage who does what he wants with no consequences?

You do know that's all just propaganda for his supporters, right? surely you wouldn't fall for something that obvious.
 
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namelesstacotruck dijo:
I personally care less about the nuclear weapons and more that Iran had "death to america!" As their fucking pledge of allegiance for school children my entire life. I am also tired of hearing about them all the fucking time. No more death to america sand nigger faggots death to you instead.
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I couldn't disagree more. Violent retards getting a nuke next to a nexus of trade is important. The opinion of foreigners is not.
 
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