Disaster Girl Guide leaders expelled for questioning trans policy - If you don't want troons raping your daughter, we'll shut down your Girl Scout group

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/34139ed0-bea5-11e8-8d21-451ec1df6b83

Two Guide leaders who had raised safeguarding concerns about the organisation’s transgender policy have been expelled and had their units closed down.

Dozens of children face disappointment because there is no one else to run the units. The expelled leaders say they will take legal action against Girlguiding if their removals are upheld.

Helen Watts, one of 12 leaders who signed a letter to The Sunday Times in April asking for a review of the policy, was told on Friday that her membership was being terminated after more than 15 years with the Guides.

At least one other signatory, based in the northwest of England, was expelled. Documents seen by The Sunday Times suggest disciplinary investigations have been launched against at least five Guide leaders.

Watts, the leader of a Rainbows unit for girls aged 5 to 7 in Ealing, west London, said: “I am very upset and I am also really angry. We had some serious concerns about a policy that ignored basic safeguarding principles.”

Watts was told she was being removed because she was “not willing to follow Girlguiding’s equality and diversity policy in so far as it provides for transgender inclusion”. She was also accused of calling a fellow volunteer a “nightmare” on a private Facebook group visible to 20 people.

Since last year the Guides have allowed male-bodied trans adults who self-identify as women to be Guide leaders and trans children who self-identify as girls to be members. On trips the children can share lavatories, showers and sleeping accommodation. The policy says parents should not be told if their daughter’s leader, or a child, is transgender.

Watts said: “The policy puts all leaders in a really difficult position. It contradicts other inclusion policies — for certain faith communities for instance — and it completely contradicts existing policies around informed parental consent.”

A parent from Watts’ unit, said she was shocked at the decision: “Helen is amazing. My daughter loves her — she is so professional and she makes the parents and the children feel so welcome. It’s a real shame what has happened.”

Another expelled leader said: “I was told my membership was revoked, I had to shut my unit down and I was not allowed to talk to the girls or their parents. They said I was refusing to follow Girlguiding procedures. I told them I would follow any procedure unless it conflicted with the safety of a girl in my care.”

She was also accused of being disrespectful on social media, but said Girlguiding had not given her any examples.

Girlguiding said: “Two individuals were found to have breached our volunteer code of conduct and social media policy and sanctions have been applied accordingly” and added that the expulsions were “not based on the individuals’ personal views”.
 
We will continue to destroy your careers and social institutions until your tolerance level improves.
 
Wait, what are they even claiming here? that troon activists are secretly MRAs, trying to sneak-attack the TERFs? JFC, There aren't enough ends on a horseshoe to cover all the varieties of rctarded in 2018 gender politics.
They're claiming transwomen are men, therefore transwomens rights activists are men's rights activists.
 
We should have troon vs TERF barbed wire cage matches for charity. Then we kill the winners too.
 
Y'know, they have a group for the ones with penises.

It's called the Boy scouts.
Screw that, we need the Troon Scouts.

It's the organization we put the troons in. They'll learn how to shitpost on tumblr and cry about the patriarchy there, before killing themselves with pills when they exit their troon phase and realize they fucked their bodies and minds up for life.
 
They're claiming transwomen are men, therefore transwomens rights activists are men's rights activists.
If you're a woman who identifies as a man, then everyone who disagrees with you is terrible. Until you try to defend actual cis men, then we revoke your right to identify yourself, you shitlord. The party is speaking, and has spoken.
 
The more I see things like this, the more I understand fundamentalists and begrudgingly see their point of view...

It isn’t so much funde entalism, as it is not creating problems that civilization solved and cast out years ago. Troons bring about the fall of civilizations. Heck even famed feminist Camille Paglia documents and warns about it. Just because they are fundies doesn’t mean they are wrong about everything. God help us they are wrong about most things... just not everything. The “no penises in the ladies locker rooms and showers” is probably one of those.
 
I mean, it seems fundamental that when a society has decided to abandon actual inquiry that searches for truth and instead decides there's no such thing as truth/truth is only knowable by God/everyone has their own truth and none is better or worse than anyone else's, it gets worse.

I don't think the whole troon thing would be a big problem, or inspire such passionate argument, if it wasn't paired closely with a very specific "left is right, up is down, if you only think about it enough" species of postmodernism. Everyone being willing to acknowledge the basic facts at hand (i.e. transwomen are men who want to be women and really don't want to be men, they have male bodies that are sometimes-but-not-always modified to more closely resemble a female body) would mean there could be reasonable compromise solutions.

It's so bizarre, like having a debate about a taxes where first, you have to agree that the entire Forbes 500 list is totally broke, or looking at the results of a mathematical system where everyone agrees ahead of time that 2+2=5.

This is a place where Ayn Rand got some shit 100% right. If you build a totally absurd but "wouldn't it be nice?" premise into your argument and refuse to allow any debate whatsoever on a pleasant-but-false axiom, that absurdity will lead to absolutely insane results that almost no one would have initially agreed to if they'd known that's what being nice would lead to.
 
I realize this is the UK, but this article really has me scratching my head.

Many organizations I'm familiar with have policies in place where adults and kids shouldn't be mixing without proper supervision or chaperones and that mixed groups of children shouldn't be together in certain scenarios solely for risk management and minimization.

If I've read the OP and thread correctly, the Girl Guides as a governing body appears to see no problem with troons of any age being around minors, especially those at an impressionable age, and that risk management policies can be set aside in the name of diversity, wokeness, and inclusion.
 
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